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05:51:14 syv: Current feline payload in inventory: Two
05:53:51 syv: Oh, if you intend to make better rocket launchers for use with Valencite, don't buff power *and* payload.
05:54:23 syv: Just one extra payload grade will give launchers that are equally as good as if they have an extra payload *and* power.
05:55:15 syv: But only when loaded with Valencite.
05:55:38 syv: Though, with stabilized Valencite, this would mean they'd have D/D rockets.
05:56:53 syv: I support this wholeheartedly.
05:58:11 syv: Do note that production cost of stabilized Valencite is 75 per three arty loads, and this would mean they have equivalent capacity to arty. So 25 just in production cost, probably another 25 for the improved bang.
05:58:42 syv: ...By which I mean the D payload rockets.
05:59:53 syv: Doing the arty cannon trick means you'd get C/C guns with D range, though *those* might cost 75 for the guns, and you need Stirk's exoskeletons as well.
06:00:53 syv: Which puts them up to... what, 150?
06:01:18 syv: A bit more, since they need more valencite to get to C/C. 33% more, I think.
06:02:06 syv: This actually makes it sound worthwhile to just make two types of BIG RAWKET which we give to infantry platoons.
06:05:47 syv: I wonder if we could make a production thing that produces a set of high payload rifles, high payload rockets, and high payload mortars, all for 75-100 cost, making a fully outiftted infantry platoon with E/E, D/D, and D/D attacks cost 100 + 75 + 50 and two production turns.
06:06:10 syv: Though really they'd be quite fragile for all that money. Don't have the armor of tanks, or the range/speed of jets.
06:23:36 ER: how dare these be entertaining
06:24:00 syv:
Dev, thoughts on my infantry gun theorizing?
06:25:26 Devastator: a power and payload upgrade to inf rockets with valencite is two power upgrades AND two AP upgrades with your proposed new kabooms.
06:25:35 Devastator: skipping the payload makes it 1 and 1.
06:25:53 Devastator: putting power above payload means you don't get the power bonus anymore.
06:26:09 syv:
Dev, you have misunderstood what I said.
06:26:37 syv: Infantry rockets are F/F/F/E. Pow/AP/Range/Pay
06:26:53 syv: +1 Pow +1 pay makes them E/F/F/D
06:26:58 Devastator: thought they were F payload.
06:27:09 syv: Add stabilized valencite, D/D/F/D
06:27:23 syv: ...Which is the same as F/F/F/D + stabilized valencite.
06:28:21 syv: I actually had thought they were F payload, too!
06:28:46 syv: But I checked my screenshot of the statlist, as I often do, and went "oh"
06:29:50 Devastator: Let me check again.
06:30:18 syv: Overall it doesn't seem quite worthwhile to actually do the thing with buffing infantry weapons a whole ton, since it puts them into the same price range as jets while maintaining a lot of disagvantages. Which is expected, I suppose; cost of infantry being med, jets being large.
06:30:46 syv: That said, I'm surprised at the potential.
06:31:36 Devastator: There's lots of choices.
06:31:58 syv: We wouldn't happen to be allowed to just *buy* mortars with D payload, would we?
06:33:36 Devastator: If you're okay with them being F/-/F/D, sure.
06:33:41 Devastator: can find you some recoilless rifles.
06:33:56 syv: That's not terrible, no. Cost?
06:42:09 Devastator: ..It's also slightly worse than just buying more artillery..
06:43:45 syv: Basically it's just a bonus for infantey you'd deploy anyway. Weak enough they probably won't be a priority target, strong enough that they might be able to end a very close battle. And infantry are likely to survive, so it's a one-time cost upgrade.
06:45:50 syv: Also it's actually cheaper than artillery if you consider that infantry are deployed *anyway*. 25 for guns, 25 for explosives, you get a D/E attack. Arty is an E/F attack, increasing to D/D if you add in 25 cost for the explosives. So 50 vs 75, and arty's advantages are +1 AP grade and +2 range grades.
06:46:02 syv: While having much *lower* durability.
06:46:41 syv: It's not a good idea to buy more infantry to add more guns, but it's fairly reasonable to add to infantry that you have anyway.
06:47:11 syv: Assuming, of course, this doesn't mean you need to replace infantry a lot more often. Which, to be fair, it probably does.
06:48:17 syv: If we made artillery producable as a [small] size weapon, how expensive would one gun be?
06:50:58 syv: Which makes these remarkably comparable, though artillery isn't as efficiently statted for use wirh valencite.
06:51:24 syv: The range is nice, though.
06:57:01 syv: These numbers really do work out remarkably well. 50 for exo, ~75 for E/E/D/C arty cannon, ~25 for valencite, 50 for inf. Gets a C/C gun on a medium D body for 200. Comparing to a jet, which should reach C/C with their other advantages around 250-275, it seems pretty straightforward. 50 more cost seems reasonable for the stat difference, accounting for the fact that jets are large while this gun is small.
06:58:07 syv: I'm *really* happy with Valencite.
06:58:58 Devastator: "These numbers really do work out remarkably well"
07:13:50 ER: oh god, that splash invisibility potion is something
07:36:47 Devastator: "You know things are getting...interesting...when the undead have enough time to build siege weapons... "
07:37:31 syv: If the undead have the smarts for it, it seems very very likely that they
07:38:17 ER: especially if they have a cool and attractive dark mage leading them
07:42:03 syv: Something something black leather straps
07:55:50 syv: God I hate this mobile firefox
07:56:10 syv: They updated it, now there's a back button to look at the previous page!
07:56:40 syv: New issue discovered: When I finish typing in a password and click login, the page jumps a half inch and I click forgot password instead.
07:57:11 syv: At least for imgur. Bay12, thankfully, does nothing until I tap again.
07:57:31 syv: And I *still* have to scroll to check if the click registered.
07:57:47 syv: I posted that link of the mozilla
dev flipping off people for complaining about this, right?
08:00:20 Devastator: oh god, that's annoying.
08:02:37 syv: She set her twitter account to private, so I'm hoping that's a sign she got enough flak that they'll sack her.
08:06:20 Devastator: ducks stealing cows.
08:06:32 syv: So that's what's happening.
08:13:54 Devastator: the ducks are very amusing.
08:16:54 syv: Never been a fan of ducks.
08:17:13 syv: Fuuuuck how did I mess that up?
08:26:15 ER: watched all the videos, now I should probably go to sleep or something
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09:03:43 MidJag: I can't sleep, so I thought I'd hop on for a bit
09:04:23 Devastator: well, new Dream minecraft manhunt video.
09:05:01 MidJag: I saw havent watched it, but it looks intresting
09:09:58 MidJag: Would not recommend shoulder surgery. Not being able to sleep is a bitch.
09:10:54 syv: Yeah, having a broken shoulder is so much more fun.
09:12:43 MidJag: Hush. It was only partially dislocated and all the tendons torn up.
09:13:45 MidJag: Yeah, turns out you shouldn't ignore shoulder pain for a year.
09:14:22 MidJag: On the plus side I get some cool scars to add to my collection.
09:14:54 Devastator: Also,
MJ, what's in this picture?
09:15:56 MidJag: It looks early iron/bronze age duck human relations have broken down.
09:16:17 Devastator: That's surprisingly accurate.
09:17:21 Devastator: Ducks stealing cows from a iron age clan.
09:17:59 Devastator: Although here's when they really have broken down.
09:20:16 MidJag: Thats a cool looking war party. Armors not the most accurate, but cool.
09:20:19 Devastator: Although you aren't forced to be hostile with the ducks.
09:20:49 MidJag: What are all of these from?
09:21:26 Devastator: A relatively obscure game.
09:22:43 Devastator: Also, sometimes other clans don't like it when they see you as too friendly with the ducks.
09:23:41 MidJag: Tgats a lot of exstensive art. I like it. I've always thought iron age stuff is neat.
09:24:24 Devastator: well, feel free to play it.
09:24:37 Devastator: and remember, don't mix up Elmal and Eurmal.
09:25:38 Devastator: I'm not kidding. Eurmal is the heroic trickster god.
09:25:59 MidJag: wait really? The back half of the horse/
09:26:09 Devastator: standard horse god of protection kinda thing.
09:26:16 Devastator: Eurmal is a horse's ass. ;-p
09:35:46 MidJag: Alright. I'm gonna try sleep again.
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11:00:09 Devastator: "It's incredibly rare for a new tricksters to pop up, so if you don't get a Trickster in your initial nobles, don't count on ever getting one. Why are Tricksters so rare? Simple: They're assholes. They worship the trickster god Eurmal, and take glee in fucking up everything around them. Very few clans will put up with them for long. Of course, if you get one on the ring, then you have an...
11:00:10 Devastator: ...asshole who tends to be slightly more focused on fucking up other clans than on you. They also let you put an extra point of magic into Quests at sacred time, which is incredibly powerful - Heroquests are dangerous, so you want all the help you can get."
11:04:28 syv: Also, I'd think they'd *commonly* pop up, since they get ousted from clans often. Assholes rapidly become vagrants.
11:15:34 Devastator: The downside is they cause problems to you sometimes.
11:16:02 Devastator: and they're not common because they have to be identified at 15, and then dedicate their lives to being assholes.
11:22:29 Devastator: And if you keep them around, they'll continue being assholes for the next fifty years, because Trickster worshippers are blessed with long lives.
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