00:13:34 Devastator: do you like burgers,
Piecewise_?
01:28:57 Devastator: It's going to be a long, long time until I forget that scene.
03:41:56 Piecewise_: of course I like brg
03:43:10 Devastator: with this diff been making home bergs.
03:52:02 syv has joined #einsteinianroulette
03:53:41 syv: I have a computer that can play videos now.
03:54:44 Devastator: fleshhorror dating sims..
03:54:55 Devastator: Didn't we try that sort of thing once?
03:54:59 syv: Oddly enough, of the two I know of, I haven't actually read either.
03:55:17 syv: Turns out, none of us like fleshorror enough to get past the pedophilia.
03:56:44 Devastator: Clearly we must not be japanese.
03:58:21 ER: I assumed that you were directing me to create a fleshhorror dating sim rtd
03:58:35 syv: ...Nope, but that would be awesome.
03:58:56 ER: which made sense to me because I was thinking about carbosilicate amorph reproduction
03:58:57 syv: The poke is because I can watch Eva again, and you previously voiced unhappiness about waiting for me.
03:59:07 Devastator: could to fleshhorror dating sym rtd.
03:59:12 Devastator: oh that would be nice.
03:59:40 syv: I've thought a little about dating sim RTD mechanics.
03:59:50 syv: It would be simpler to make a yandere sim rtd.
04:00:17 syv: I still think that could be pretty great.
04:02:46 ER: I checked 21 and I don't think we've seen it
04:03:58 Devastator: give me about fifteen.
04:04:04 Devastator: I'll be ready soon.
04:04:16 ER: because 20 memorably ends with a gratuitous yet entirely unanimated sex scene
04:04:20 syv: No problem, I still need to put stuff on laptop.
04:04:39 syv: The worst kind of sex scene.
04:06:08 Devastator: still potato internet?
04:07:25 syv: Today I'm at work though, so great internet.
04:07:44 syv: (I literally could not download NP++ at home, my internet is so crap)
04:08:07 ER: cly you have to start living wherever you work
04:08:21 Devastator: wow, that's impressive.
04:11:10 Devastator: Don't worry. You totally aren't under a government where someone could bribe enough to ensure the future continuance of the monopoly, along with no oversight to force minimum levels of performance.
04:11:21 Devastator: (do have my sympathies, though.)
04:11:39 syv: At least I don't live in Russia.
04:14:05 Devastator: throwing doctors out of windows.
04:14:12 Devastator: ..that said, this is how Putin started, really..
04:14:23 Devastator: Anyway, on that note.. maybe anime.
04:14:36 syv: I like anime more than politics.
04:14:49 ER: let us discuss the politics of gendo
04:15:37 ER: not starting with the intro!?
04:17:29 ER: aw yeah, groovy Cruel Angel's Thesis
04:17:35 syv: Only a brave man would stab god's left testicle for science.
04:18:00 Devastator: That's the reverse.
04:18:52 Devastator: dammit, I would have been able to read it there.
04:19:58 Devastator: kinapping Ikari's second in command to get actual info.
04:20:16 Devastator: That's a bold step.
04:20:35 ER: good way to get ikari to toss you into hell
04:20:56 Devastator: Not doign it is a good way to get tossed into hell.
04:21:39 syv: ....It's super weird that Gendo took *her* name.
04:21:57 ER: I dunno what japanese culture is on that
04:22:00 Devastator: I don't know, maybe her family had higher status.
04:22:13 Devastator: or maybe he was a criminal or something.
04:24:43 Devastator: 2001 must have been rough.
04:26:08 Devastator: So.. she got pregnant during 2001? mmm..
04:27:07 syv: Madoka is much more Jesus-y. Shinji whinges too much.
04:27:50 syv: I keep hearing her name as "Huey"
04:28:16 Devastator: "You knew the second impact was going to happen?"
04:28:21 Devastator: ..so did he actually cause it?
04:29:18 Devastator: ie, they didn't do it.
04:29:55 Devastator: Yeah, definately over the edge.
04:32:12 Devastator: mmm, so she's magic too.
04:32:43 Devastator: That's concievable, but I'd bet against it.
04:35:24 Devastator: happy I called that he caused the second impact, though.
04:36:48 Devastator: Could be something weirder.
04:36:56 syv: We do keep seeing her in a tube.
04:37:07 syv: Could be a resurrection/reincarnation.
04:37:54 ER: lil child of the apocalypse
04:38:36 Devastator: so should have went for that,
ER.
04:39:07 Devastator: or some mad scientist.
04:40:15 syv: Didn't check the chamber...
04:42:12 ER: slow piano Fly Me To The Moon
04:44:14 syv: Huh, one second before the end, yeah
04:49:34 Devastator: that going to be the target of impact #3?
04:51:07 syv: So all the appropriate pilots have dead parents?
04:55:06 syv: The sapient penguin still bugs me.
04:55:16 Devastator: So there going to be nothing but history and recap episodes until the last one?
04:55:40 Devastator: Two episodes ago we had a guy melt into sludge.
04:55:45 Devastator: and the penguin is the weird part?
04:56:32 Devastator: Seems to be just pleasantries.
04:56:39 Devastator: might be stuff, but I don't understand it.
04:57:06 syv: ...Was her hair always brown?
04:57:17 Devastator: might be the off focus.
04:58:36 Devastator: Just use the magic plug.
04:59:03 Devastator: The magic pilot substitute plug.
04:59:19 Devastator: I was hoping she'd mention the penguin in response to the cats.
04:59:22 ER: this anime should just be about her cat
04:59:28 Devastator: maybe it's invisible to everyone but her household members.
04:59:35 syv: Cats! Plural. Just cats, no humans.
04:59:56 Devastator: yeah, spending the money here.
05:00:13 Devastator: Oh, found an anime about red blood cells.
05:00:26 syv:
Piecewise_, do you have any anime exclusively about cats?
05:01:39 Devastator: I was hoping for stuff like that from Irony's game about idols.. ;-p
05:01:51 syv: I could really see that anime appealing to Japanese sensibilities.
05:03:36 Devastator: "But these are all magic kids born fifteen years ago. How many backups can we have? ;-p
05:03:47 syv: Nah, they just need trauma.
05:04:08 Devastator: Torrent of Ardent Pathos.
05:04:25 Devastator: go steal it for PS.
05:04:46 Devastator: another thing I'm never going to hit you with.
05:05:27 Devastator: It'd be.. kinda unfair.
05:05:39 syv: Angels seem much less fair than kaiju
05:05:43 Devastator: There are limits on what the enemy can do.
05:06:10 Devastator: Pfft, he left behind the seeds of His own demise.
05:06:24 Devastator: that's as fair as anything else can be.
05:09:08 ER: this is prolly what it feels like for a human to be eaten by a witch, btw~
05:09:35 syv: This exact kinda thing is one of my worst nightmares.
05:09:50 Devastator: Might be different for each person and each witch.
05:12:25 Devastator: so that first angel had a gun.
05:12:46 Devastator: that's making the assumption that he cares about preventing the third impact.
05:13:08 syv: He just wants it to happen at the right time.
05:13:14 Devastator: I think that only matters inasmuch as it might cause issues with his own plan.
05:13:17 Devastator: so yeah, same thing.
05:15:02 Devastator: oh.. so third impatct will be the moon, then?
05:15:40 syv: Impacts are literal, it's just what happens when you yeet the staff into the ground.
05:16:05 ER: rei's only going downhill I see
05:16:22 Devastator: sometimes you gotta hit bottom before you can move forward again.
05:16:46 syv: Yeah, she needs to hit max despair and mellow out a bit.
05:17:00 syv: And then she needs a hug. :\
05:17:20 ER: please I beg of you give the animes hugs~
05:17:40 syv: I don't think there will be any more hugs in this show
05:20:23 ER: today's smbc pertains to the fairness of god :P
05:21:20 syv: Intellect is correlated to health while growing up, from nutrition and such. So is height. Penis size is correlated with overall size.
05:21:31 syv: Correlation =/= causation.
05:22:11 Devastator: next ep is called "Tears"
05:22:34 syv: Also "Rei III" for the second half
05:22:52 ER: we can have the op, as a treat
05:23:07 syv: I wonder if when this originally aired, people just weren't sure whether they had the right show for the last two eps.
05:23:26 Devastator: not a new thing, though.
05:23:30 ER: it does say "director's cut"
05:23:47 syv: I think they only added stuff in the director's cut.
05:23:52 Devastator: I do dearly wish I'd called myself Pathos.
05:23:58 syv: Need to check when we switch to movie.
05:23:59 Devastator: that would have been a first-rate forum name.
05:24:06 Devastator: I think
PW said all save last ep.
05:24:25 syv: Also, I like you better as
Devastator.
05:24:34 Devastator: I'd have predated it.
05:24:55 Devastator: I'd have wrecked a meme for you?
05:25:00 ER: it was a user too, you know
05:26:50 Devastator: maybe THAT should be my next forum game.
05:27:05 Devastator: "You are a generic girl in a high-stakes anime."
05:27:40 syv: That feels more like my writing style.
05:27:46 syv: Lots of helpless pathos there.
05:28:31 ER: I mean, you're not PART of the high-stakes shit
05:29:02 ER: you only have the distant melencholy of the world maybe ending, but outside your control
05:29:05 syv: Yeah. You just get to see people suffering, and can do nothing about it.
05:29:06 Devastator: THE WORDS HAVE FAILED
05:29:35 ER: angels are getting more bullshit
05:29:50 syv: They have gotten more bullshit every single time.
05:29:55 Devastator: The limitation of the entirely defensive outlook.
05:30:13 Devastator: that WILL eventually come up in k-com.
05:32:36 Devastator: "well, we lost the big spear, and I don't have another one of those."
05:34:57 ER: she wasn't afraid to die, so she died, and that was that
05:35:12 Devastator: Tis one of the drawbacks with soldiers who aren't afraid to die.
05:35:22 syv: Well, we're to the point of people having to burn single-use resources.
05:35:34 Devastator: Yes, but those single-use resources are infinite.
05:35:54 Devastator: they're limited by the plot.
05:36:16 syv: It's fiction, yes, so they can write in anything. Anything is infinite.
05:36:23 Devastator: but yes, a main character died.
05:36:39 syv: But no, within the framework they've shown, they can't add more heavy consumables without getting worse at writing.
05:37:29 Devastator: To be honest, I'm kinda annoyed at the usage of 'dead sea scrolls'
05:37:31 ER: they need to expend the pengion
05:37:37 Devastator: because I'm vaguely familiar with them.
05:37:43 syv: Pengion, the penguin region
05:38:12 Devastator: Did they have a backup Rei?
05:38:26 syv: Or they pulled the same rez shit Shinji pulled earlier.
05:38:56 ER: yeah, one was killed by scientist chick's mum
05:45:04 Devastator: high stress situation.
05:45:28 Devastator: It is an excuse, just not a justification.
05:46:18 Devastator: that's excuse (v), not excuse (n).
05:47:34 ER: it's rude to melt someone's replacement bodies when it has literally just been shown that she needs those
05:47:59 Devastator: think we're in end of eva region now?
05:48:22 ER: I mean, I was just going to watch through them all
05:51:40 ER: maybe he'll fly and get the spear
05:52:46 Devastator: man, things are really bad.
05:53:14 Devastator: Yeah, that's.. sloppy.
05:54:49 syv: Huh, Gendo really gets around.
05:54:54 ER: god's in his heaven and all is right in the world
05:55:54 Devastator: you know, after this I'm going to go listen to that in full.
05:56:54 Devastator: I'm betting he's the devil.
05:57:12 ER: nyarlathotep is way cooler than the devil
05:57:27 syv: He might be an evil sociopath. Don't think he's a magic person.
05:58:01 Devastator: No, it's the devil, he's got the japanese devil face.
05:58:14 Devastator: and he was humming Ode to Joy. It's theology, gah.
05:58:32 Devastator: Either that or it's a deliberate inference.
05:58:51 Devastator: ie, it's too obvious. Plus he's got the red eyes.
05:59:05 syv: He blushes with this guy every time.
05:59:29 Devastator: group showers are normal.
05:59:43 Devastator: Devil boy x generic girl.
06:00:07 Devastator: You've got enough to ship it already.
06:00:17 Devastator: I mean, you had enough upon his first apperance, but there's plenty. ;-p
06:00:24 Devastator: "Life is suffering."
06:00:28 Devastator: Yeah, they're playing with it.
06:00:51 syv: This came out of fuckin' nowhere
06:01:45 Devastator: Yeah, and that was the red face flash frame in the opening.
06:02:30 syv: Those are ridiculously crappy blankets.
06:02:54 Devastator: ..and what do you know of blankes, Flordian?
06:09:29 Devastator: Is this the only self-destructing facility where that might be somewhat reasonable?
06:12:26 Devastator: Ahh, so it was all a fake. Well done.
06:12:35 Devastator: That finally makes sense.
06:13:02 ER: shit, we need to pad this out
06:13:04 Devastator: and I'm sure the next ep will show it all to be totally wrong.
06:13:18 syv: I'm expecting him to just release K
06:14:44 Devastator: The mother fucker faked an angel. He faked them with the EVAs. He faked them with Rei. He made his life. And he faked one more, Adam.
06:14:56 Devastator: That, whatever it was, was not the real adam.
06:15:19 syv: He called it Lillith, which he earlier stated to be the progenitor of man.
06:15:41 syv: Adam is the progenitor of angels.
06:15:50 ER: I think they said that it was created by man based off of the adam at antarctica
06:16:13 syv: Did that come from Seele or Gendo?
06:16:26 syv: Because I don't think anyone else actually has any clue.
06:16:44 Devastator: What was made there came from Gendo. Seele signed off on part of the plan, but they've been mostly duped too.
06:16:55 Devastator: only guy with the full pic is Gendo or maybe his assistant too. And now, God.
06:17:28 Devastator: Seele is the org funding Nerv, the council members.
06:17:45 syv: I don't think they're really human in the end.
06:17:46 ER: they were also ordering around the literal angel
06:18:01 ER: so yeah, I don't think they're human
06:18:07 syv: Also angels are apparently a paired existence to humans, so I don't think humans are ordering them.
06:18:20 Devastator: Nah, they're as much human as anyone else, they simply teamed up with that guy for the mission.
06:18:34 Devastator: he mentioned vanilla humans as 'lilim', and mentioned how they were even willing to work with him.
06:18:42 ER: as human as anyone else doesn't seem very human, int his case
06:18:53 Devastator: Nah, he was the last angel.
06:19:14 Devastator: the seele councillors were human.
06:19:22 Devastator: anyway, the game is genuinely starting at this point.
06:19:25 syv: He was the last of the dead sea angels.
06:19:52 Devastator: Yes. Was bang on calling him the devil. ;-p
06:20:12 Devastator: boards clean, anything can happen.
06:20:24 syv: Seele I think is just the mind behind the attackers. The parallel to Lilim.
06:20:47 Devastator: but Seele's almost certainly the name of the parent organization.. the councillors.
06:20:55 ER: they said that they created nerv to be their will
06:20:57 Devastator: Lilim are human beings in general.
06:21:10 Devastator: Yes. Seele was present at the founding and put Gendo in charge to begin with.
06:24:07 Devastator: Damn metaphorical fogs!
06:24:29 Devastator: gotta merge with it and cause the third impact, boy!
06:25:59 ER: this seems like a stage, like pathologic
06:37:27 syv: So... hivemind analyzing everyone?
06:37:39 Devastator: nobody could hold out forever.
06:37:45 syv: Not sure whether it's psychologically attacking them all or if they're all just broken.
06:37:54 Devastator: It's doing neither, imo.
06:37:58 Devastator: it's doing what it feels best.
06:38:10 ER: it's... reconsiling them, I think
06:38:21 syv: They're ALL solid pathos though.
06:38:31 Devastator: Gotta break them down to fit into the mold.
06:38:40 syv: Which would count as an attack.
06:38:54 syv: Not just analyzing them entirely, only the broken bits to hurt them.
06:39:14 Devastator: You'd think so. I'd think so, but hive ethics think otherwise.
06:39:41 syv: Yeah yeah, I know, I *said* it was good in a broken moral system weeks ago.
06:40:04 syv: I'm just not sure whether that's the author's intentions, or if they really did write a fully broken cast.
06:40:04 Devastator: "Truth is what doesn't go away when you stop believing in it."
06:40:53 ER: Driven Assimilators best ethics obviously
06:41:55 syv: Yeah I got no fucking idea what's going on.
06:42:04 Devastator: Mmm. I see why the ending got rewritten. This looks certainly like something that's unsatisfying.
06:43:03 syv: "But I'm depressed, I want to write an ending that's just depression."
06:43:06 Devastator: Essentially,
syv, hive ethics are forcing the others into a league of mutual conformity, while attempting to grant a compromise between omnipotence and shared experience. They aren't actually talking to each other, they're all inside their own heads trying to create something where they can survive.
06:43:32 syv: Alternatively, "I had this horrible fever dream and it was such a notable and weird experience that I wanna write it as happening to reality"
06:43:41 Devastator: When they do so, they might or might not encounter each other again, but right now everyone and everything is shut off.
06:43:59 ER: want to watch the las tone?
06:44:23 Devastator: don't see why I'd stop here. I mean, the movie might be more satisfying, but this is something.
06:44:32 Devastator: unless the last ep just upends everything so far.
06:45:13 ER: I understand that the ending is every character telling shinji "congratulations" and then no actual conclusion
06:45:24 ER: but, I would like to see for myself
06:46:00 Devastator: That does sound really, really bad.
06:46:16 ER: that's why we downloaded the movies :P
06:47:03 syv: I think all this is just a cheap ending. Literally ran out of funding, so showing all the characters in featureless spaces just talking was what could be done.
06:47:22 Devastator: They're doing some work within those limits, yeah.
06:47:52 Devastator: but.. I don't like transhumanist narratives because I find them boring and tedious as fuck.. and I suspect this one won't be much different.
06:48:01 ER: last torrent of ardent pathos
06:48:33 ER: "we don't have time to show you everything lol so let's skip to the end"
06:51:45 syv: "Somebody go out and take some pistuces of stuff"
06:51:47 Devastator: Absolutely no idea why people could find this an unsatisfying ending to a shonen mecha show.
06:51:53 syv: "We'll put a filter over it"
06:52:06 syv: "Nobody will even notice."
06:52:30 syv: But yeah, this looks like they had a budget of two dudes, a camera, a laptop, and the cutting room floor.
06:52:59 ER: and all the voice actors :P
06:54:10 syv: I can see why this would make a show popular and famous in itself.
06:54:20 syv: It's so fucky and weird, how could it not be famous?
06:54:41 ER: fucky and weird things fail to be famous regularly~
06:54:43 syv: This is the shit that can be debated about for centuries.
06:54:56 ER: but probably because they're simply jank and not well done
06:55:09 Devastator: Eh. It seems pretty garden variety with like lots of artsy dressup on it.
06:56:08 ER: at least it's more than akira~
06:56:18 syv: It has a simple explanation but is weird enough that you can argue about whether or not that explanatioj is accurate forever.
06:56:37 Devastator: "I am what I am in the dark."
06:56:56 syv: Exactly the opposite of what they just said.
06:57:28 syv: Using concept art instead of reused footage now.
06:57:32 Devastator: Yeah. There'd be no way for anyone to stand against this kind of agressive psychoanalysis, but I'd give that hive mind a hard time.
06:58:12 syv: If all of reality and time is someone asking you "why" repeatedly, occasionally interjecting insults and shit, yeah.
06:58:19 syv: There's not really any winning there.
06:59:01 ER: fucking plato coming along and asking you questions until you give up
07:02:24 ER: and yui is alive now, cuz why not
07:02:38 syv: Because perfect fantasy world.
07:02:44 Devastator: I do have to give it credit for being more accurate to how the whole thing will be surprisingly meaningless.
07:02:57 syv: Ughhhhh this reminds me of Rebellion.
07:03:29 Devastator: Could be. Impossible to know.
07:04:02 Devastator: and nothing new will ever occur.
07:04:20 syv: Much as I hate agreeing with you on that sentence, yes.
07:04:56 Devastator: It's hardly inarguable.
07:06:42 syv: I like rainy days, personally.
07:08:13 Devastator: and now.. nothing will ever occur again!
07:08:48 ER: most satisfying ending ever
07:08:51 syv: Nah, stuff can totally still happen.
07:09:00 syv: The writers just have to say stuff can happen.
07:09:00 ER: this right here? it's fucking canon
07:09:28 ER: canon doesn't mean anything, so I can say it is
07:09:38 ER: for me, this is canon, because that's funny
07:09:51 Devastator: Eh, wasn't so bad.. but yeah, that does seem like they ran out of money.
07:10:17 ER: same way I say that the ending I got in Unavowed where everyone I love dies and I'm a slave forever is my personal canon
07:11:14 syv: Ugghhhh I never added the dub files to the movies
07:11:56 ER: but yeah, fuck things making sense ;p
07:13:01 syv: We never saw Gendo tell Shinji to get in the fucking robot.
07:13:15 ER: that was the start, I assume
07:14:04 Devastator: Laputa was a good movie.
07:14:33 ER: I think it annoyed me somehow
07:16:50 Devastator: I liked indestructo-kid.
07:20:44 syv: Okay, figured out how to play dubs.
07:26:00 syv: EoE tonight, or another night?
07:26:08 syv: If we start now I'll have to pause in the middle.
07:26:39 Devastator: definately watched enough for a night.
07:27:06 syv: I mostly just want to finish it and be done.
07:30:12 Devastator: dunno if I'll be in the mood tomorrow. Maybe Monday?
07:32:52 syv: Tomorrow *is* monday to me.
07:36:21 syv: Should I start pressing
MJ to find time for MR?
07:36:38 Devastator: Have to see him first. Absolutely.
07:39:59 syv: We talked a little yesterday, actually.
07:40:20 syv: Apparently the MCAT is FUBAR, so that's what his stress has been about lately.
07:40:51 Devastator: Yeah, been stressing about that for a while.
07:40:57 Devastator: oh, good luck there.
07:51:59 syv: Thought: devilboy called the absolute terror field the thing which separated one's mind from the rest of the world.
07:52:32 syv: Killing devilboy--which he said was the choice of allowing humans to live--seemed to be the thing which sparked instrumentality. Unless Rei did that.
07:52:59 Devastator: Gendo did it a few days later, I think.
07:53:56 syv: Thought they were saying she was pretty much an angel herself, and had a powerful AT field, what with the new one popping up in the middle of devilboy's thing.
07:54:08 Devastator: it did involve Rei.
07:56:06 ER: I'm inclined to believe that it's pretty much all bullshit
08:01:22 syv: Anyway, the whole thing with lilim and angels being antitheses of each other aligns neatly with angels having isolation fields and humans ending up as a hivemind once the isolation fields are gone.
08:01:38 syv: Aside from Rei also having one and being part of the hivemind.
08:03:41 ER: better eat a soul real quick
08:04:36 Devastator: that's worth the full heal, right?
08:05:09 ER: yeah, humanities are fullheals for some reason
08:05:39 syv: Also does kinda work with Gendo and Seele being at odds, though their cooperation is also odd. If Seele wants instrumentality, that implies they're lillim and can partake. If they're not lillim, then that implies they wanted another impact, not intrumentality, and Gendo defied them sparking it.
08:05:55 syv: Humanities aren't souls though
08:06:03 syv: They're little teeny bits of Manus.
08:06:29 syv: Or his lord soul, anyway, since souls are fucking weird in DaS.
08:06:37 ER: humanities are the integral parts of humans
08:06:44 ER: souls are just general life force
08:07:00 syv: But humans are created by Manus, and are made human by humanities.
08:07:35 syv: And humanity is the dark soul, which was the fourth lord soul.
08:07:57 ER: they're the core of a human, so they're the soul as far as a soul is a singular object holding a person's mind and personality
08:08:00 syv: The currency souls are other soul bits, I think. From Gwyn's or Nito's or Que's.
08:08:16 syv: Or maybe just non-lord souls.
08:08:40 ER: the white souls are just described as being part of anything living
08:08:57 syv: ...Hrm, yeah, dragons have them too.
08:09:04 ER: seemingly in amounts proportional to that being's size and power
08:10:22 ER: humanities bunch up together inside of humans as a glob, and they're unique to humans, and they are what makes humans human. Which is generally what people mean when they say soul.
08:10:35 ER: and the name of the game is Dark Souls ;p
08:11:25 syv: But they're not what makes a person themself, their personality and emotions and all that.
08:11:59 syv: They're fuel for that person, and humans need bits of their lord soul to function properly, but peoplea re still the same people even if they're starving to death.
08:12:00 ER: I guess that's just the brain
08:12:51 ER: which the bonfire restores from backup when you get stabbed in the head? sure.
08:13:23 syv: So DaS doesn't have a named equivalent for the metaphorical soul as people think of it in our world, and souls are life force.
08:14:02 ER: when the player dies, their body dispiates. They're left with 0 souls, and they're left with 0 humanity
08:14:13 ER: *what is it that returns to the bonfire*?
08:14:33 syv: Some fragment, you still have your stats.
08:14:51 ER: and also everything you've ever picked up :P
08:14:52 syv: And if you invade someone and get killed, they get currency souls based on your stats.
08:15:38 syv: Chalk it up to the flow of time being convoluted.
08:15:50 ER: but if you invade someone you're not in your body
08:16:03 ER: something *made* of souls, presumably
08:16:30 syv: But someone can drain your humanity from your souls, by the exact same mechanism you drain humanity from NPCs.
08:17:26 ER: through whatever connection you use to control the drone body you're projecting into a parralell universe, presumably
08:17:51 syv: Also if your phantom drops things, you lose them.
08:18:33 ER: though, nobody has to pay souls or even use up an item to summon a phantom through a soapstone marking, so how's that work
08:18:53 syv: Yeah, phantoms for nothing, souls for free.
08:19:47 ER: I guess specifically the white souls are not a finite or scarce resource, even in DS's weird apocalyptic setting
08:20:23 ER: they're just running out of the dark souls. I guess.
08:20:43 syv: Which, yeah. You can kill the same bush a million times for millions of souls.
08:21:01 ER: or, they're running out of "fire"
08:21:21 syv: Which is running low, yeah.
08:22:16 syv: And can eat dark souls to prolong itself, which is okay because dark souls can apparently reproduce and spread?
08:22:26 ER: so we're running out of... specifically lordsoul fragments, but not out of life force in general?
08:22:46 ER: which would make sense if undead end up as still-living but not quite human
08:23:13 syv: Which they do, consider they just keep going until they decide "fuck it".
08:24:07 ER: I imagine that all the "corpses" you pick up items from are actually alive, but essentially afk :P
08:24:28 syv: Yeah, you've told me that one before. I've adopted it as well, it's such a good headcanon.
08:25:02 syv: Which reminds me, HP is supposed to just be the character's will to live, not actual structural integrity. I wonder if that's a human thing, or just applies to everything.
08:25:17 ER: hmm, so the only reason why we're running out of humanity is because gwyn is stealing them through bonfires in order to prolong the fire soul.
08:25:29 syv: Dogs? Dogs die quick because they have terrible pain tolerance.
08:25:58 ER: Which is why when you kill him and don't link the fire there's an "age of darkness", because there will be no more fire soul but plentiful dark soul once more
08:27:03 syv: On the other hand, we don't actually really want humanity so much, since we really consider the ideal amount to be just a decent dribble. Gwyn's not giving us even that much, but getting rid of him and having a torrent causes terrible things like Oolacile and New Londo, which are decidedly worse IMO.
08:27:10 ER: so you hit the iron golem until it passes out from pain and then rip out the still-living dragon bone inside of it?
08:27:23 syv: Or just push him off the bridge, yes.
08:27:46 syv: Is there any other reason why we could kill him by just punching his ankle a few hundred times?
08:29:06 syv: Hmm, that would be a completely pointless mod. Add self-damage whenever you punch things with your bare hands.
08:29:15 syv: Gauntlets reduce the damage, but don't negate it.
08:29:37 ER: hmm, and when we stab a hollow and they flop on the ground, they're not actually dead, they just decided not to fight you anymore
08:30:05 syv: Yeah. Which is why some hollows go down super easy, and others are fucking tanks despite wearing rags.
08:30:05 ER: and then you can kick them around
08:30:15 syv: They vary in how much DETERMINATION they have.
08:30:48 ER: okay but how do the painted world hollows do so much damage with the exact same broken weapon
08:31:11 syv: They've been sitting there killing each other for centuries, unable to escape.
08:31:22 syv: So they have tons of souls, which they pumped mostly into STR.
08:31:57 syv: Those motherfuckers could dual wield Smough's hammer.
08:32:10 ER: why were the gods afraid of priscilla like, at all
08:32:27 syv: She was too kawaii to kill.
08:32:37 syv: So if she attacked them, they wouldn't be able to defend themselves
08:33:03 syv: Lifehunt was just a ruse so that nobody could learn her true power.
08:33:05 ER: how can someone who turns invisible in combat be too kawaii to kill
08:33:27 syv: Well, she only does that against humans.
08:33:40 syv: Humans have the dark soul, so they're assholes and her kawaii doesn't work on them.
08:33:44 ER: and if it were true, why would she deactivate her most powerful defense as a defense mechanism
08:34:12 ER: so humans have sole right to be jerks?
08:34:24 ER: that... hmm, doesn't check out :P
08:34:39 syv: No, they're just the only ones resistant to cute things.
08:34:47 syv: Gods are still assholes to not-cute things.
08:35:50 ER: cute has better be a status ailment in elden ring, from
08:36:15 syv: ...I actually am struggling to think of something depicted as cute, which the DaS gods killed.
08:36:25 syv: Probably because DaS largely just lacks cute.
08:36:56 syv: Elden Ring is From Soft's next big DaSy action game,
Dev.
08:37:04 ER: theyve prolly killed baby dragons
08:37:16 syv: It's written by GRRM, the GoT dude.
08:37:21 Devastator: I'd be amazed if there's nothing cute in it.
08:37:47 syv: They missed some dragons, not killing the babies could be why.
08:37:58 ER: I guess that's why people are enamoured with priscilla. because there's literally no other cutes in the game. ;P
08:38:05 syv: Dragons probably had very few babies anyway, since they were double immortal.
08:38:17 ER: even the cats are weird lookin and not cute
08:39:07 ER: did the gods fight the daughters of chaos ever?
08:39:19 syv: No, the daughters of chaos *are* gods.
08:39:52 ER: but not the community of them living in anor londo
08:40:08 syv: Do the mushroom kids count as cute?
08:40:19 Devastator: how can one be double immortal?
08:40:35 syv: They have scales that make them immortal. And also crystals that make them immortal.
08:40:50 syv: It's a reference to Plauge of Gripes anyway, just a joke.
08:41:18 ER: sun wukong is a lot more than double immortal
08:43:55 ER: You know, I really like how in demon's, DS2, DS3, and Bloodborne you always need the designated waifu to level up, and in DS you just do it yourself, like jeez it's not that hard
08:44:09 ER: the chosen undead is their OWN waifu
08:44:44 syv: I'd be happier if it were the inverse. Priscilla's the only *good* waifu in the games.
08:44:49 syv: Except the doll, she's good too.
08:45:15 syv: Get rid of the fire keeper, emerald herald, and dark magical girl whatsherface.
08:45:37 ER: people seem to really like the maiden in black :P
08:45:59 Devastator: Why is priscilla the only good waifu?
08:48:49 Devastator jots that down for Saeko.
08:55:38 ER: write that down write that down
09:10:51 ER: now, what is the idea way to set up a fleshhorror dating sim rtd?
09:11:10 Devastator: work out some simple mechanics and a setting.
09:15:50 ER: cly we follow the lives of a few hatchling fleshhorrors on a pristine jungle island as they grow, develop, and eventually seek love
09:16:04 ER: and at some point humans show up and mess shit up
09:20:05 syv: Aliens from another dimension contact earth, both groups are mutually excited to interact with other intelligent life.
09:20:37 syv: Japan, leading the world in diplomatic outreach, quickly accepts exchange students into their schools.
09:21:23 syv: Make sure it's rushed and neither culture has any real understanding of the other.
09:21:35 ER: You're normal human students in a normal human world who have sworn to compete for the affections of the new exchange student, who is everything to everyone due to being Nyarlathotep.
09:21:58 syv: Nooo, Nyarlathotep is evil.
09:22:06 syv: Also there's already an anime about it.
09:23:19 Devastator: the human wouldn't be good.
09:23:43 Devastator: So the players competing for one fleshhorror?
09:25:44 syv: I suspect it'd be better if the fleshorror were trying to woo people.
09:25:56 ER: no, my idea is following the natural fleshhorror life cycle, like a chill nature documentery~
09:25:58 syv: Might be a good suggestion game.
09:26:26 syv: And, like, actually entirely fluffy and happy with no permanent murder.
09:26:28 Devastator: mmm, one person in fleshhorror world?
09:26:38 syv: Or deliberately horrible trauma.
09:26:48 syv: Like Pyro, but with a bit less death.
09:27:49 ER: one human in fleshhorror world sg and we let things be wholesome or horrifying according to the choices! ;P
09:29:33 syv: It's weird being able to upload things.
11:35:59 syv has quit [Quit: You hear a distant scream of "FUCK T-MOBILE!"]
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20:42:41 IronyOwl: Elf Academy is at 5/8 actions
20:43:00 IronyOwl: hopefully I didn't scare anyone off by telling Tric he couldn't damn someone to a contrived death
20:43:53 Devastator: Well, I think he could do that.
20:44:01 Devastator: just needs a different thing than Time.
20:44:35 IronyOwl: yeah, maybe Fate or something
20:44:57 Devastator: Or Time and, say, Particular: Fate
20:45:08 Devastator: doom someone to death by.. something that isn't time.
20:47:33 Devastator: so good to see you, Irony.
20:47:39 Devastator: I set a time limit in k-com.
20:47:49 Devastator: If
ER and
syv drop out, I'll nerf the opfor a bit and keep going.
20:48:13 Devastator: and probably take on another org and maybe do some other stuff.
20:49:06 Devastator: Any issues with my orders in Elf Academy,
IronyOwl?
20:51:09 IronyOwl: and yeah, I saw the time limit in K-COM
20:51:19 IronyOwl: two weeks is rather generous tbh T_T
20:52:15 Devastator: I'll update Sh a few times before then.
20:52:32 Devastator: think I might start a different game instead, too.
20:55:01 IronyOwl: what'd you have in mind for a new game?
20:55:48 Devastator: eh, bunch of various ideas.
20:56:07 Devastator: nothing real firm yet.
20:58:22 Devastator: A SG where you go through this JRPG plot I laid out with a friend of mine when I was in college a decade-plus ago.
20:58:46 Devastator: like sh, but more tactical combat and less freedom.
21:04:17 Devastator: "You are generic girl", a SG where you are living in some kinda anime show as a bystander or a member of a crowd.
21:11:03 Devastator: A game where you are a shmup pilot, except you are in groups, and you'd be like arcade players.. you're heroic, but you'd go down pretty often.
21:13:41 Devastator: Do you have any suggestions,
IronyOwl?
21:26:13 IronyOwl: well... what interests you?
21:26:30 IronyOwl: you seem to have rather particular tastes, but I'm still not entirely sure what they are
21:26:32 Devastator: could run whatever. Anything you'd like to see?
21:28:35 IronyOwl: hm... some kind of management/Majesty/Dungeon Keeper like thing could be cool
21:28:58 IronyOwl: or like Darkest Dungeon, come to think of it
21:29:27 Devastator: but what do you do in it?
21:30:05 IronyOwl: manage or cater to adventurers, maybe?
21:31:08 IronyOwl: this is one reason I asked what you like, it's easier to hit likely zones if I know what you're already fond of
21:33:16 Devastator: I like running games where it feels like you're part of a living world.
21:33:19 Devastator: beyond that.. whatever.
21:33:41 Devastator: Did you ever read Birdgame?
21:37:27 IronyOwl: ahahaha what am I reading
21:37:57 Devastator: well, that's reassuring.
21:39:48 Devastator: "Roll to Save the World."
21:39:51 Devastator: It's right there in the title.
21:49:42 IronyOwl: you know those anime dungeon villages, where adventurers come delve the dungeon which is basically a living thing that constantly changes and refreshes itself with monsters and loot?
21:50:13 IronyOwl: one of those, and either you're a shopkeeper or otherwise Purveyor Of Useful Things trying to make a living
21:50:40 IronyOwl: or if you wanted to spring for multiplayer, players can take several different roles- adventurer, shopkeeper, maybe scheming noble
21:50:52 Devastator: I can do a shopkeeper, but what would gameplay be like?
21:51:10 IronyOwl: ever played Recettear or Stardew Valley?
21:51:39 Devastator: I have played Recettear.
21:52:00 Devastator: seemed gameplay was.. you do everything an adventurer does except play dressup with a shop. ;-p
21:52:24 IronyOwl: in this case I was thinking somewhat more opportunistic
21:52:27 Devastator: Dunno. If I had the MC run a shop, it'd be a game about running a shop. Maybe something else.
21:52:34 Devastator: could be similar, but a different role.
21:52:40 IronyOwl: like if you notice there's no alchemist shop, that'd be something to pursue
21:52:53 IronyOwl: if you notice one of the major adventurers wears heavy armor, products related to that could be handy
21:52:55 Devastator: "You're a Royal Guard", and it's your job to dive into the dungeon to pull out lost, stuck, or dead adventurers.
21:53:18 IronyOwl: it's thankless work, but nobody's threatening the king anyway!
21:53:28 Devastator: Ahh, forgot that idea.
21:53:41 Devastator: "You are a solo adventurer."
21:53:57 IronyOwl: oh yeah, vaguely related to... goblin slayer or something?
21:54:03 IronyOwl: I think you mentioned something about it before
21:55:41 Devastator: yeah. Like that, but more wonder and exploratoin.
21:57:14 Devastator: but "You are a Royal Guard" could work.
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22:32:12 ER: unfortunately for the world, I think I have a pretty robust setting in my mind for the "I'm a japanese exhange student on a spaceship full of shapeshifting aliens!?" sg
22:34:25 IronyOwl: I mean I'm also interested, but wat
22:35:25 ER: I'm not sure if I even want to run that, but there's certainly the shape of an OP in my head now. :P
22:36:16 Devastator: also, elfquest today?
22:37:16 ER: it's a giant conch shell and it's full of affable fleshhorrors
22:37:51 ER: the inside smells like a hospital full of rotting organs
22:38:32 ER: they have a whole deck which is basically a nature preserve of their natural habitat, because they need animals to eat and reproduce.
22:40:10 ER: They basically start out life as a virus which takes control of a small animal's nervous system, then gradually become more complex, gain a limited ability to morph, and switch bodies with progessively larger animals until they're an adult and can shift at will
22:40:31 ER: at which point they basically just subsume smaller animals
22:50:04 IronyOwl: and why have you been transferred to this, um... unique experience?
22:51:20 ER: and we're imagining that everyone in this scenario is overly excitable xenophobes who decided to go ahead and do an exhange student thing without any preperation or planning
22:51:48 IronyOwl: what's the ah, payoff of the game?
22:52:00 IronyOwl: what are we trying to do, what's neat about it?
22:52:30 ER: I dunno, date a fleshhorror?
22:53:47 ER:
syv popped into the channel with "fleshhorror dating sim" and I started thinking about what that could mean within my own abilities
22:54:03 ER: I'm not all the way serious. Probably. Unless...?
22:54:35 Devastator: I wasn't sure if that meant the player was the fleshhorror or the player was trying to date a fleshhorror.
22:54:38 IronyOwl: Well, what are the alternatives? :p
22:55:05 IronyOwl: oooooh, if you're the fleshhorror you could be managing stress and hunger bars
22:55:06 ER: multiplayer fleshhorror life cycle sim
22:55:17 IronyOwl: let things get too out of whack and you'll feast on whoever's nearby
22:55:24 IronyOwl: whether that's your date or your boss
22:55:33 IronyOwl: either way, aaaaaawwwkwaaaaaaaard~
22:57:48 Devastator: hmm, maybe run my own monster game instead, too. Could call it "Devour". Be like
Paris's, except the creature has stronger needs.
22:58:08 Devastator: I suppose 'fleshhorrors dating other fleshhorrors is a possibility.
22:58:57 ER: though of course I would wrap it up in the entire life cycle because that's my fun
23:02:26 Devastator: that's another idea.
23:02:40 Devastator: adventure where you wake up back in the hospital every time you die, and you die often because something insane is happening.
23:02:50 Devastator: AH style, but I'd have a very different setting and cosmology.
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