00:01:27 Aigre has joined #einsteinianroulette
01:49:16 ER: it was a gamecube horror game
01:50:22 ER: has you play as a bunch of different characters in different time periods.
01:50:31 Devastator: what brought that on?
01:51:31 ER: "could be"? I mean, it just is.
01:51:34 Devastator: TBH, I'm planning on just playing the dungeon straight. We might be being tricked here, but there could always be another layer of tricks beyond that.
01:51:48 ER: What do you think the Tome of Eternal Darkness is from? :P
01:51:48 Devastator: So just take things as they are, concentrate on the goal, and simplify stuff.
01:58:06 Devastator: I suspect I would have won Spelunky by now if I'd just went for the ending instead of trying to accumulate all the crap.
01:58:38 ER: I still want to get to the golden city.
01:59:22 ER: I don't think you get much for it other than a potential to gain loads of money, but it's the challenge getting there that's interesting.
02:08:54 Devastator: did manage to cash in a skull.
04:20:45 Devastator_ has joined #einsteinianroulette
04:22:56 Devastator has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
04:22:58 Devastator_ is now known as Devastator
04:37:21 Devastator: kill six billion demons still has six billion to go.
04:44:48 syv has joined #einsteinianroulette
04:45:07 Devastator: apparently the ghost makes gems bigger.
04:45:25 Devastator: I hope we can get orders from Twin or Nak in Pumsy's.
04:45:38 ER: if the ghost moves through any gem it turns into a diamond.
04:45:43 syv: Yeah. Both of them are pretty unreliable, though.
04:46:11 syv:
ER can still submit orders for Mina, if necessary, though I'd be pretty surprised if he went with anything aside from the obvious.
04:46:20 ER: Tempted to toss some temp orders in, but I'm giving them a chance to show up for now.
04:46:57 syv: I sent them a PM, so maybe that'll prompt a response.
04:47:21 Devastator: Twin's been on the forums for most of the last week. Nak's been mostly absent.
04:47:47 ER: oh yeah, I had her toss the halberd, so she doesn't have it now. :P
04:48:52 ER: It's kinda bad that the only one with a ranged attack is out of comission.
04:49:15 syv: It was embedded in the wall maybe four feet away.
04:50:08 ER: probably need CC to yank it out of the wall, though.
04:51:10 syv: Y'all should get some guns, so that you always have ranged attacks available.
04:51:21 ER: Also, from last turn I assumed that the claysphereman's tie was actually at the center of its bodymass, but the most recent description says it's just at the front.
04:51:37 syv: If it were at the center, would it be visible?
04:51:52 ER: From Mina's perspective? Yes.
04:52:06 syv: It's in the center of the front. And out her SS' range.
04:52:56 syv: Anyway, are either of you interested in watching a blind DaS stream?
04:53:17 syv: Didn't you say you'd be unable? :P
04:53:38 ER: just... gotta.. get up in the morning tomorrow, but I can watch a while, sure. :V
04:53:57 syv: www.twitch.tv/syvarrisvutheniama/
04:54:44 Devastator: I'm assuming the obvious move is to help Tooru in some way.
04:54:58 Devastator: I was planning on getting some degree of manabolt or a gun,
syv. Maybe both.
04:55:11 Devastator: Eh, could Alida pull it out of the wall.
04:55:34 Devastator: Stream shows as offline.
04:55:36 syv: So I was very confused there because I had my stream open.
04:56:30 Devastator: What is up with the body thing?
04:57:31 Devastator: Welcome to my world,
syv.
04:58:39 Devastator: consider it payback for an hour spent blathering about werewolves.
04:59:26 Devastator: Wow, that's a sad torch.
05:00:53 Devastator: Should have blue on the loading screen.
05:00:57 Devastator: because this is an ill-concieved venture.
05:01:08 ER: they all represent that though
05:01:17 ER: blue is just the most obvious
05:03:08 ER: pink has made many mistakes in many timelines
05:04:13 Devastator: as I said, welcome to my world,
syv.
05:05:22 ER: I can imagine the panic is someone invades you~
05:09:13 ER: the game sound is very faint
05:11:26 ER: hah, agression works on friendly NPCs?
05:12:50 Devastator:
syv getting lost yet?
05:13:47 Devastator: cheating hotkeys, or required to run the mods yet?
05:15:52 Devastator: hacked camera angles need to be reset.
05:15:53 ER: 2hr2 for the estoc is also a stab
05:17:21 ER: think the drake squished one of them
05:18:08 Devastator: What's the Vit for anyway?
05:18:43 Devastator: don't kill the merchant by accident like I did.
05:18:47 Devastator: fewer enemies to murder. ;-p
05:20:36 Devastator: It's okay if it's short, you can't see long enough to use a big weapon, anyway.
05:25:31 Devastator: be glad it isn't actually first person for rolling.
05:27:53 Devastator: ahh, the fear, the fear.
05:27:58 Devastator: go murder that black knight.
05:28:37 Devastator: you seen that latest xkcd,
syv?
05:28:41 ER: who kills everything so you don't have to4
05:29:41 Devastator: I like how you can see the arrows stuck in your body.
05:30:25 Devastator: (I am disappointed that resin doesn't fill the screen with flashing lights. Not quite my world, then.)
05:34:25 Devastator: not as much need for lockons with this camera angle.
05:37:39 Devastator: "Give me your sword." "No, stop stabbing me with it."
05:38:52 ER: the buckler guys are annoying
05:39:18 ER: they have a LOT of deflection for using a light shield
05:40:51 Devastator: what was a horrible idea? The tactical mistake or this mod combo in general?
05:43:59 Devastator: embered fire. If someone +1s the bonfire you're at, you full heal, right?
05:45:12 Devastator: It's fine if you backstab,
syv.
05:45:16 Devastator: not too disorienting.
05:46:42 ER: that high value ring of sacrifice :P
05:47:44 Devastator: assuming you can find your souls.
05:48:08 Devastator: Ahh, all is right with the world.
05:50:11 syv: Nothing is happening, so I can start it back up.
05:50:38 syv: I have to check the sky every hour, more if there's anything, but there's literally not a single cloud in the sky.
05:54:26 Devastator: didn't get your souls?
05:59:34 Devastator: looks like their blockade worked fine.
06:02:53 Devastator: good axe after all.
06:03:25 Devastator: "It is dark here. You are likely to be eaten by a grue."
06:04:34 ER: the madoka loading screen gets me every time
06:06:13 Devastator: It's literally all dark, isn' it?
06:06:44 ER: does this place even have a skybox?
06:09:30 Devastator: could be non euclidian.
06:11:58 ER: this fight looks almost astral
06:12:34 Devastator: Should have an all-black dungeon in Pumsys. ;-p
06:14:37 ER: flashlights wouldn't help if everything is totally black
06:14:51 Devastator: Well, you could see the glows from the other magical girls.
06:14:58 Devastator: and stuff you bring into it may not be totally black.
06:16:34 Devastator: "Oh god, I don't have any.."
06:16:43 Devastator: Did you lose your sacrifice ring?
06:20:17 Devastator: What's the wolf ring do again?
06:21:53 Devastator: which is the ability to have your animations uniterrupted, right?
06:24:21 ER has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
06:25:22 Devastator: didn't you get the wolf ring?
06:25:25 Devastator: You mean some other ring?
06:29:59 Devastator: It's half-bright here.
06:30:05 Devastator: I suppose that's everywhere fater darkroot.
06:30:43 Devastator: Decided on a regular weapon yet?
06:36:48 Devastator: apparently doing double damage helps a lot.
06:39:10 Devastator: "You know what's good about this giant halberd? It makes a good off-hand weapon."
06:45:20 Devastator: You'll also be one of the luckiest targets possible. ;-p
06:47:41 Devastator: The halberd has feet of clay.
06:47:50 Devastator: I meant luckiest as in 'easiest for your skill'
06:48:00 Devastator: Never be at a worse disadvantage.
06:49:59 syv: I turned it off ecause I left. Have to leave at every :47.
06:50:59 Devastator: More multiplayer than I was expecting.
06:53:24 Devastator: It's not that big of a deal.
06:53:30 Devastator: if you don't get invaded, that is.
06:53:34 Devastator: The proper edition. ;-p
06:53:43 Devastator: Yeah, splitting the playerbase is bad.
06:56:37 Devastator: You know, what would a pyromancer run like this have looked like?
06:58:31 Devastator: nnneyeh, sounds about right.
07:00:35 Devastator: Easy part hard, hard part easy. ;-p
07:03:11 Devastator: What do you have against the Penguin?
07:03:37 Devastator: I know not for NPCs.
07:04:44 Devastator: Yeah, don't forget those.
07:07:38 Devastator: Much better doing 100 damage at a time instead of what, 19?
07:09:01 Devastator: Also why they named Littlefinger's three knights that in A Song of Ice and Fire.
07:09:12 Devastator: Well, "Kettleblack", but yeah.
07:11:25 Devastator: that's how things go.
07:12:46 Devastator: I thought they'd just have different stats.
07:15:17 Devastator: Only took me three tries..
07:15:19 Devastator: can't be that hard.
07:18:55 Devastator: I did, but I couldn't use it, the glow was too annoying.
07:19:03 Devastator: Weren't you watching me do Capra?
07:23:09 Devastator: They normally can't.
07:23:16 Devastator: but on occasion they clip up those stairs.
07:28:48 Devastator: I hope that didn't cost too many souls.
07:32:08 Devastator: who are those d-bags?
07:32:08 Devastator: you have firebombs, right?
07:33:25 Devastator: you wanted one dex for that spear.
07:39:38 a has joined #einsteinianroulette
07:40:46 syv: Just missed
a blind dark souls run.
07:41:05 Devastator: Not blind in the conventional sense.
07:41:08 Devastator: the opposite of that, really.
07:41:19 Devastator: blind as in 'everything is like the Tomb of the Giants'
07:41:23 syv: Iiterally blind, when I've memorized the whole game.
07:42:08 syv: I decided against leveling dex for the spear because I've been using the longsword/axe combo, which is really just better. At least for now.
07:42:27 syv: Maybe when I get
a truly long spear, like the SKS, I'll switch up again.
07:43:04 syv: Oh, do you want to see more of that run? or should I just do the rest on my own time, as
a standard challenge run?
07:43:54 Devastator: I wouldn't mind seeing more of it, but it's not
a serious matter of urgency for me.
07:44:04 Devastator: If you want to play it, play it.
07:44:44 syv: I think the Depths should be fun, so I'll save that for
a stream.
07:45:08 syv: And by fun, I mean it'll be full of me getting hopelessly lost and attacked by things at random, constantly.
07:45:19 syv: Because the Depths is
a *maze*
07:45:32 Devastator: You'll still get less lost than I did.
07:46:01 Devastator: I remember you screaming at me, because of how lost I was.
07:46:15 syv: My mental map of the Depths is one of my worst, only beaten by Blight Town, which will be so much worse.
07:48:38 syv: At least they'll be somewhat visible.
07:49:06 syv: You can see arrows fine in TotG, and it's the same effect, so they should be trackable by the darts.
07:49:44 syv: Seriously though, I think I'll do catacombs first.
07:49:51 syv: Kindling, levels, and it's easier.
07:51:36 syv: ...Also, great scythe. <3 GS.
07:53:05 Devastator: How would you grade a scythe as
a totem weapon?
07:53:43 Devastator: What's so good about the GS?
07:54:08 syv: Fairly poor. If it's the realistic version, it would be more effective, 'specially since I like polearms, and mobility means range is trivial to control.
07:55:43 Devastator: Okay. So bad but better than that club.
07:57:34 syv: Yeah. If it's the unrealistic version, it'll hurt because it'll be handled more realistically. Maybe better than the club, but only in limited circumstances, and bad rolls would be even worse. An L-shaped scythe would get disarmed by pure accident.
07:57:58 syv: It'd also only be better due to reach, and if the user has generally good rolls.
07:59:44 syv: The GS in DaS is amazing because it has phenomenal reach, a phenomenal moveset, and phenomenal damage. Only flaws are that it has stumble frames and low poise damage... but those don't even balance it. It's
A+ tier in PvP, and possibly the best stumble weapon in PvP.
08:00:05 Devastator: what are stumble frames?
08:00:50 syv: It's longer than most spears, its R1s have decent speed, its R2s have massively sweeping areas of damage, and best of all, its running R1 is sbout as fast as *dagger* r1s.
08:01:11 syv: Stumble frames are where your char stumbles for
a half second or so after missing an attack.
08:03:00 syv: All halberds and axes have them. They're pretty easy to punish with a backstab in PvP (and you miss a lot in PvP), which is why axes and halberds are almost never used. There's
a couple exceptions due to otherwise great traits, like the Black Knight Greataxe (sheer damage and speed), and the Great Scythe (range and speed), but most of the rest of those classes are considered absolute junk.
08:04:14 syv: ...I also might be wrong on the BKGA having stumble frames. The basic GA doesn't, pretty sure, and is in the same class.
08:05:16 Devastator: you know, we never played any Allegiance.
08:07:21 syv: I don't think
ER had much interest.
08:07:41 syv: If you can rope him into it, though, I'm still up for trying it out again.
08:09:12 ER has joined #einsteinianroulette
08:09:19 ER: haha never mind I can't sleep
08:13:04 syv: You still interested in trying
A leg at some point?
08:16:19 syv: Such
a belated period for an extreme statement.
08:16:33 Devastator: I have all three artifacts and just killed a mummy for
a sceptre.
08:16:41 syv: I guess that means
ER is the only person in our little group to never even try
A leg.
08:16:44 Devastator: I might get through that gold door.
08:19:22 ER: congrats. everything is made of gold
08:23:10 Devastator: Well, dead. New high score, 195000 gold.
08:23:51 Devastator: ..although it says I only have 151k, because I died with 40k gold counting up.
08:26:58 Devastator: There's normal treasure as well as the gold walls.
08:27:05 Devastator: and
a giant gold statue.
08:47:42 ER: yeah, I'm hungry. that probably shouldn't surprise me because I haven't been eating very much. So I guess I'll eat something.
08:50:59 syv: Too much caffeine, don't feel hungry at despite barely eating today.
08:51:24 syv: Sideways, with
a rusty pitchfork.
08:54:03 Devastator: Yes, which is why I linked only the image.
08:58:53 Devastator: I'm not linking to
a post.
09:00:31 syv: Eh. I saw the site, I was filled wirh hate.
09:05:27 ER: also there's
a lot of cookies lying around unguarded, so I've been eating things but not much real food :P
09:06:19 syv: I wouldn't mind having some cookies. Wanna share?
09:16:05 syv: Aww, man, if only CoIP were a thing. The "Have
a cookie" thing would *actually get cookies*!
09:16:26 Devastator: Don't worry. In the future you can have plastic cookies.
09:18:14 syv: Hmm. If people 3d printed cookies for you, that could become
a problem.
09:18:21 syv: Well, not you, but someone.
09:18:38 Devastator: They don't work anyway.
09:18:48 Devastator: Just terribly useless toys.
09:20:58 Devastator: Yeah. Very slow, very power intensive, very finicky, and batch manufacturing only.
09:21:53 syv: Good for prototyping, though.
09:22:10 Devastator: Lousy for prototyping.
09:22:10 syv: Fast and cheap for some things too.
09:23:05 ER: people just want their fucking star trek duplicators already
09:23:07 Devastator: Assuming 'cheap' doesn't include energy.
09:24:08 Devastator: The guy I used to work for gave up on it at last, and started paying a local machining firm to just make his damn custom valves. Takes
a quarter the time, and the per-piece price is higher, but only if you don't include the hours spent tinkering with it.
09:26:40 syv: I know
a guy who has one, which he got after working with one on an engineering job. He's generally been pretty positive about it, and isn't the sort to choose an impractical solution for foolish reasons.
09:26:56 Devastator: Spent quite
a load of money and time trying to make it do something it wasn't suitable for.
09:27:11 syv: Admittedly, haven't talked about it much, and don't talk to him often. Could be wrong.
09:27:20 Devastator: Then he doesn't use it for the wrong things.
09:28:09 syv: I know he professionally had to use it for prototyping small device casings, no idea what he does with it now.
09:28:10 Devastator: To be fair, I've never known anyone who owns one of them to hate it, even when they're spending 12 hours playing with it and having half their attemps collapse.
09:28:38 Devastator: That sounds about what to use it for.
09:28:45 Devastator: 'give me
a box to put the stuff that matters in.'
09:29:25 Devastator: Don't see why that wouldn't work, most of the time.
09:29:31 ER: using things wrong is
a leading cause of doing things wrong
09:39:50 Devastator: So what was that dungeon game you were saying dridergame was imitating?
09:40:58 ER: ...I'm saying that the GM is blatantly referencing Eternal Darkness for the gamecube, which isn't really
a game that has much to do with dungeons.
09:41:16 Devastator: Anything about the plot or something that you think might be relevant, then?
09:41:22 ER: It's survival horror like resident evil or something, but with sometimes swords and magic
09:41:56 ER: the plot is about
a bunch of elder gods who hate each other, pretty much.
09:42:53 ER: I've only seen an LP and it was a long time ago, but I think that the whole game is
a gambit of one god to mess with the other three
09:42:57 Devastator: Ahh, so probably relevant, but it'd be difficult to tell.
09:43:08 Devastator: That might move it up to 'quite relevant' then.
09:43:33 ER: go watch
a longplay of it or something if you really want :P
09:45:26 Devastator: Well, as long as we make sure there isn't some kind of total devastation, we should be fine.
09:45:34 Devastator: maybe we can eat the power thing the other guy is retrieving.
09:45:59 ER: well yeah, that's out whole thing, right?
09:46:19 ER: just frikkin eating anything that looks eldritch or powerful
09:47:35 Devastator: Only since we consumed the 'heart of consuming eldritch things' or whatever that was.
09:47:40 Devastator: Now it's kinda our thing.
09:49:46 Devastator: The only thing I'm worried about that is that it seems to be addictive.
09:49:49 Devastator: And we're apparently now vulnerable to anti-demon spells.
09:50:27 ER: it seems to be addictive because we, the players, keep doing it
09:51:21 Devastator: I don't know. That whole bit about 'This feels really, really, really good' sounded like addictive to me.
09:52:08 ER: it would feel good if we were addicted or not~
09:53:19 Devastator: I hope Alida isn't addicted after one exposure to Witch Cake.
09:53:19 ER: naaah, you practically live in the tropics
09:53:26 Devastator: It would suck to have
a slight increase in between-mission drain due to liking something that will never be tasted again.
09:54:04 ER: uh, depending on that witch's backstory you might be able to find it
09:54:26 ER: cause I mean, it could just literally be drugs you know?
09:54:42 Devastator: I think Mina would have been able to see what kinda drugs it was if it was normal drugs.
09:54:46 Devastator: I think it was Magic Drugs.
09:56:22 Devastator: On the plus side, you usually don't get addicted after one dose of anything.
09:56:42 ER: that's not really gonna happen
09:58:04 Devastator: It's going to be Innocence to see if that happens, and
a critfail means she's addicted?
09:58:06 Devastator: something like that?
09:58:26 syv: Purity would be rolled for addiction.
09:59:21 syv: ...Sophia wouldn't be very vulnerable to addiction.
09:59:26 ER: ...what actually is the thematic tie between innocence and thinkiness?
10:00:01 Devastator: I don't think I took Cursed Purity, but I've failed or critfailed every single purity roll so far.
10:00:08 syv: I think I was going with "The belief you can understand and change your fate if only you analyze it enough."
10:00:16 syv: Really though it's the Homura stat.
10:00:44 Devastator: Wouldn't that be Innocence by your power list?
10:00:51 ER: Sophia doesn't have much of it because she never went to school. makes sense to me.
10:01:03 Devastator: Yup, Amateur. Still failed them all.
10:01:07 syv: (
ER) ...what actually is the thematic tie between innocence and thinkiness?
10:01:09 syv: (
syv) I think I was going with "The belief you can understand and change your fate if only you analyze it enough."
10:01:10 Devastator: Maybe I can get someone to help her roll with that.
10:03:28 Devastator: I'll think about that if we live through this.
10:04:08 ER: I'm mildly happy that there's
a decent chance you won't all get through this, to be honest~
10:06:08 Devastator: I'm suprised you made it out.
10:06:37 ER: I pretty much didn't, because I'm dumb!
10:08:12 Devastator: better than doing nothing because it would be 'premature' to help the almost-dead character.
10:10:28 Devastator: got nothing but respect for Nak as a person, but that wasn't
a smooth move.
10:10:32 Devastator: Still, we all make boners.
10:13:13 ER: it's an internet person of some sort
10:14:03 Devastator: If it matters, I think Nak's
a woman.
10:14:05 syv: I automatically assume male for most B12ers, but I'm pretty sure Nak's been referred to as female.
10:14:57 ER: if the profile doesn't say, I don't make assumptions
10:14:59 Devastator: I'm fairly certain, but you don't exactly know these things.
10:15:14 ER: because they is just such
a nice word and deserves to be used~
10:15:15 syv: I'll ask them sometime, then.
10:15:27 syv: Just because you said that,
Dev.
10:15:28 Devastator: I am certain Nak's only one person, though..
10:15:52 syv: They're
a plurality until they only have one gender.
10:15:54 ER: could be a bunch of goblins in
a coat
10:15:57 Devastator: Sorry. I don't like how it's treated as not assuming something, when there are people who prefer to be refered to it that way.
10:16:13 Devastator: so it seems to me to be assuming something, all the same.
10:16:41 syv: What, you mean having gender be confirmed?
10:16:58 Devastator: Assuming that 'unconfirmed' means 'whatever they means'
10:17:45 Devastator: Does it tell you anything about the person being referred to, or does it only tell you about the person using the term?
10:17:47 ER: they literally means unconfirmed
10:18:55 Devastator: To some people, at some times, yes. But to others it means different, specific, things.
10:19:00 syv: If I call someone a nigger fuckwad, then that's telling you more about me than them. It's still language, being used to convey informstion, in
a useful and understandable way.
10:19:04 Devastator: As far as I can tell, the whole lot of it seems subjective.
10:19:32 ER: language is subjective, wow what
a novel observation
10:19:48 syv: It's not really that novel.
10:21:10 Devastator: Still, particularly these days, I like to make the distinction between specific people and the groups they belong to. Particulary in this age of massive partisanship and self-selection.
10:22:02 Devastator: I'd rather be wrong sometimes than just treat people in such
a bigoted manner.
10:22:02 syv: It's not ambiguous how we've been using it.
10:22:15 syv: They're legitimate uses of they.
10:22:48 Devastator: Yeah it is. It's assuming
a specific word can never be wrong.
10:23:41 ER: "It" is technically never wrong
10:24:01 syv: Problem is when you use a specific term in
a way that implies confidence, such as your usage of female pronouns to refer to Nak.
10:24:11 syv: It implies some level of knowledge about them.
10:24:17 Devastator: Yeah, and I've admitted I could have it wrong.
10:25:01 ER: using the word they implies that you don't know something, it's just shorter to say
10:25:31 Devastator: Eh. It's also something you only use when talking about other people.
10:26:00 syv: It's typically used as
a word to vary your language and reduce redundancy.
10:26:13 Devastator: And that is
a bad habit I engage in too often.
10:26:50 syv: "Group
A is bad. They eat babies. I've seen it, watching their teeth dig in is horrifying."
10:27:21 syv: Vs "Group A is bad. Group A eats babies. I've seen it, watching Group
A's teeth dig in is horrifying."
10:27:41 syv: And it has the same value for individuals.
10:28:21 Devastator: X is a member of group
A. They eat babies. I've seen X's teeth dig in, it's horrifying.
10:32:47 Devastator: And it's incredibly, incredibly common to refer to one member of
a group as representative of the entire group.
10:34:55 syv: That's
a poor use and should be rewritten.
10:35:27 Devastator: Ok. Now drop the 'member of group
A' bit, and tell me that you can be certain 'They' refers only to X, and not the group(s) X belongs to.
10:38:42 syv: "X eats babies; I've seen their teeth dig in, it's horrifying. They're also a member of Group
A."
10:39:27 syv: The way you stated it, the order implies the eating is related to Group
A, even if you excluded the "they", you'd be providing that implication.
10:40:35 Devastator: It'd be incredibly difficult to make that assumption if you use something other than they in there.
10:42:27 syv: "Alexander is
a member of the Cordonites. He eats babies. I've seen his teeth dig in, it's horrifying."
10:42:43 syv: "So, uh, is the baby-eating thing related to the being-
a-Cordonite thing?"
10:42:49 Devastator: Yeah. Even if you do that, it's clear that's not the case.
10:43:06 syv: "What? No! Cordonites are mostly good people, stop judging them by their worst member!"
10:43:51 ER: cordonites are all demons in disguise actually
10:44:32 Devastator: Sorry. Maybe I just know too many racists. They're generally prone to that usage with they.
10:45:05 syv: It's not clear. "Alexander is a Conservative. He's
a racist. Every day at work he complains about the degredation of our country."
10:45:26 syv: "Hey! Being
a conservative doesn't mean you're racist!"
10:45:48 Devastator: Also, phrase 3 doesn't have any connection with either of the other two..
10:45:54 syv: "What? Why would you think I meant that? My mom's conservative, but she doesn't have
a judgemental bone in her body!"
10:46:15 syv: Yeah, my mistake. I meant invasion by mexicans or something.
10:46:33 Devastator: See the point there? If you take out the 'they', it's pretty clear you're only talking about one person.
10:47:40 Devastator: It's also clear that you're using bad rhetoric by bringing up irrelevant points.
10:47:53 syv: The rebuttal could easily be "Yeah they are. Conservatives always get elected with racist rhetoric.
10:49:30 Devastator: Which would be legitimate, and bring up some interesting lines of debate.
10:49:36 Devastator: I'm having trouble seeing it as
a worse usage.
10:49:37 syv: These points aren't irrelevant, though.
10:50:02 syv: It's describing how you can make a statement unclear or clear with or without the use of
a specific word.
10:50:52 syv: You're saying that the word is bad to use under
a certain circumstance, because it makes the information ambiguous--and I'm saying that the information can be made ambiguous--or clear--regardless of the use of the word.
10:51:18 Devastator: If that's true, then why should I use your desired usage then?
10:51:22 syv: At best, your argument stands as
a reason for people who are incompetent or lazy communicators to not use the term.
10:52:08 syv: You don't have to. At best, it might sound more pleasing to the ear, but you could accomplish otherwise without the word. Plus, I think the value gained would be offset by your own displeasure.
10:52:49 syv: But if others feel it's the most efficient or pleasing way to get information across, it's immature of you to judge them for it.
10:53:04 syv: ...Also, you've already shown yourself to use the alternatives poorly.
10:53:14 Devastator: Which alternatives are those?
10:53:33 syv: I assumed Nakéen to be female, largely on your own account, assuming you to have
a good reason to say that they're female.
10:53:39 syv: But you don't, beyond your gut.
10:54:04 syv: You've cleared this ambiguity, but only after it was specifically brought up.
10:54:18 Devastator: What's wrong with being female?
10:55:16 syv: Statistically speaking, Nak's prolly male. I agree with your gut, myself, but B12 is mostly men.
10:55:59 syv: You communicated information to me and accidentally relayed information you didn't intend to. Or, you successfully relayed information in
a misleading manner because you had no care for my understanding.
10:56:19 syv: Either way, you've communicated in an undesirable fashion.
10:56:34 syv: Now, can I go back to watching anime, or do you have more to argue?
10:56:48 Devastator: I didn't accidently refer to Nak as female. That's what I thought was the case.
10:57:01 Devastator: If it's wrong, than I made
a mistake.
10:57:15 Devastator: I wasn't trying to do so to fool you.
10:57:30 syv: "Hero Mask".
A relative asked me to watch it. Same one as asked me to watch RWBY. This one's pretty solid though.
10:57:32 Devastator: If I was, I'm not sure what information is transmitted by gender. It doesn't matter.
10:58:13 syv: It's got
a lot of silliness, mostly around important people being demigods for no reason, but the plot is interesting.
10:58:49 Devastator: That's what I mean about people getting mixed up with the groups they belong to.
10:59:06 syv: It's well animated for the most part.
10:59:35 syv: I don't have Netflix, but I'm apparently trusted so they gave me their login.
11:00:44 Devastator: Wait, wasn't that the name of that character from OPM?
11:01:51 syv: Nobody in this show is named Snek, at least. Everyone seems to have
a full name, actually, and it's typically given promptly upon their appearance.
11:02:59 Devastator: Do they have backstories that make sense?
11:03:28 syv: Among those who've had any given, sure. They don't waste much time on it though.
11:03:53 Devastator: Pikasprey really got to you with those names, didn't he?
11:05:07 syv: ...Spatial relationships seem to be more like suggestions in thisvshow, too. Travel is done at the speed of plot, as
a rule.
11:05:26 Devastator: I wonder if the names are that bad in the original Japanese. (OPM)
11:05:56 ER: space seemed to be mostly
a suggestion in jrgurndder too
11:06:37 syv: It has good animation, but beyond that...
11:07:23 syv: I guess it has good characterization, too. This show's chars are mostly too grounded and boring, eith
a few exceptions where they're too tropey and absurd.
11:09:23 ER: JRM characters are at least memorable enough for my subconsious to pick them up and stick them in my dreams. :V
11:09:39 syv: More information demanded!
11:10:16 syv: Note: I can remember their names.
11:10:43 syv: I honestly can't recall what this show's MC's name is, except his last name being "Blood", because that's so stupid.
11:12:21 syv: It's James. He just said it.
11:12:31 syv: He wears
a stupid red jacket.
11:12:39 Devastator: There was
a Lord Blood in Lords of Midnight, but only three people get first names.
11:12:45 Devastator: Is it better than RWBY?
11:13:08 syv: Much more my sort of show, though, so YMMV.
11:13:53 syv: Oh, the physics are also reliably stupid. And police procedure.
11:14:06 syv: They have GPS bullets which they use to track people.
11:15:07 Devastator: Don't people get hurt when you shoot them?
11:15:17 ER: is there
a giant demon arm? That's the thing that gets me invested in dumb plots.
11:15:24 syv: Mr. Blud regularly does things that there should be 20+ SWAT officers for, and I am 100% sure that he does
a better job than said SWAT would.
11:15:42 syv: Nope! There's superpower masks, but it's otherwise very grounded as far as plot.
11:16:21 syv: People do get hurt! And you're not supposed to shoot people unless you mean to kill them! And GPS bullets would never work!
11:16:52 ER: you take
a bullet, put the GPS in it
11:17:30 ER: you take a bolt, stick
a shotgun shell on there. done.
11:17:38 syv: A guy was shot in the face by a 9mm GPS bullet, fired from
a 92FS (I think). He pulled it out intact, because majik mask. Later he loaded the projectile into his revolver, then shot himself with it again.
11:18:03 ER: of course that's how bullets work
11:18:21 ER: you load a bullet into a gun, then the gun shoots
a bullet
11:18:38 syv: At least they're not firing the whole casing.
11:18:57 Devastator: Aren't they, considering what that guy did?
11:19:12 Devastator: Is the bullet the entire casing and they're like electrically powered or something?
11:19:22 ER: ...I once had an idea for a sci-fi story involving a gauss revolver so that there could be
a gimmick where the cowboy fires the same bullet twice.
11:19:38 syv: No, he just magically fired
a projectile. Guns in this world are all air-powered.
11:19:53 syv: Another problem is that bullets deform,
ER.
11:20:00 Devastator: well, with air guns shooting people to track them makes more sense.
11:20:14 ER: it's probably some sort of magic space alloy shhhh
11:20:17 syv: (they aren't, they're clearly gunpowder based)
11:20:37 Devastator: ...I kinda want to see an anime where everyone fights with air-powered weapons now.
11:21:00 ER: the gun just has
a seperate gunpowder storage tank, obviously.
11:22:12 Devastator: I'd prefer ones where the guns are intended to be effective weapons, they're just, for whatever reason, all air-powered.
11:23:33 syv: There are some pretty lethal air rifles, it could make sense in some settings.
11:23:43 ER: air powered guns and air powered bombs and air powered swords
11:24:15 Devastator: I think you could do an air melee weapon.
11:24:28 Devastator: bombs wouldn't really cut it, though.
11:24:57 ER: is there any world where compressed air lethal guns are easier to make than chemical propellant lethal guns?
11:25:41 syv: One where you don't have gunpowder, or where it is very scarce, closely controlled... hell, just not understood.
11:25:48 ER: one where god tosses compressed air tanks at you from the heavens, I guess
11:25:58 Devastator: Maybe
a low-metal world so you have very restrictive chamber pressures.
11:26:38 syv: Eh. The lethal air rifles I know of all have metal construction. Plus, pressurised, durabke air tanks.
11:26:52 Devastator: and you need
a valve.
11:26:53 ER: oh, obviously religion solves all problems like this. Explosives are heresy.
11:27:19 Devastator: circles are heresy?
11:27:23 Devastator: or circles solve all problems?
11:27:25 syv: "Why are people stupid?" "Religion."
11:28:02 syv: It's triangles that solve everything.
11:28:12 Devastator: The Linear Cult, eh?
11:28:27 ER: then halfway through you can introduce the people who have
a different religion and they use gunpowder guns to utterly wreck the airgun people.
11:28:42 Devastator: Or The Church of the Trinity.
11:29:48 syv: Hmm. You know, that might make an interesting mechanic in some game. Everyone gets air rifles, and is perfectly skilled with them, but lethality is dependant on air pressure.
11:29:59 syv: The more you shoot, the less your shots will do.
11:30:03 Devastator: weaker with every shot fired?
11:30:49 syv: Yeah. Maybe have some weak luck elements, so favorable conditions have better results than blind fire and such, but have shots basically autohit when reasonable.
11:31:23 ER: Metro 2033 is
a videogame with pneumatic guns
11:31:33 ER: they're pretty fun to play with
11:31:35 Devastator: autohit could mean lots of cover getting used.
11:32:28 ER: base hit chance for
a stationary target in the open is 100% and it goes down from there.
11:32:34 syv: Hrm. Yeah. Enemies could be an issue. They can't have good weapons, else the weapons'll just get stolen.
11:32:57 ER: the enemies use propellant guns, which are heresy to use
11:33:11 Devastator: You get no reloads for enemy weapons.
11:33:37 Devastator: and the jackasses don't bring many extras since they know you guys don't have the ability to make more.
11:33:42 syv: Damn it
ER. Stop having good, obvious solutions.
11:33:58 syv: Man, having the PCs be crazy cultists just makes this even better.
11:36:57 Devastator: You could have them outnumber the opponents.
11:37:06 Devastator: The cult has more people and that's how they win.
11:37:24 ER: no, they win because air guns are the answer
11:37:49 ER: also their god has blessed them with PERFECT ACCURACY when using air guns
11:38:28 syv: They'd have to be cultists of something lovecraftian, but I don't think I could do that justice.
11:38:55 ER: HJBBKJ'HGCCF, LORD OF THE WINDS
11:39:13 ER: I mashed my keyboard and didn't type any vowels
11:39:26 Devastator: As long as they never touch
a gunpowder firearm, they cannot miss with air guns.
11:54:22 Devastator: madness in awful hospital.
11:54:27 Devastator: The More Maggots fairy.
11:54:46 ER: not the maggots fairy, the MORE maggots fairy
11:54:58 ER: for when you have some maggots, but need more
11:55:52 Devastator: Did someone just suggest that, or was there some foreshadowing I missed?
11:56:22 ER: apparently she's from some of bogleech's earlier comics
11:58:08 Devastator: ..I was kinda hoping that came out of nowhere.
12:04:09 Devastator: So who is skully going to be?
12:06:47 Devastator: And how is Divine Fuckery going?
12:07:16 ER: uh, same as before because it hasn't updated
12:08:09 syv: Hey,
ER, when do you have to get up today?
12:09:57 syv: You should probably try and squeeze in some sleep there.
12:10:07 syv: An hour or two of sleep can make
a lot of difference.
12:11:39 ER: watching saltybet is pretty much like sleeping. I sit immobile and watch some random bullshit happen.
12:12:41 syv: I'm sure you'll have
a different opinion in six hours.
12:14:30 Devastator: I think
ER got
a couple to start it off.
12:14:32 Devastator: how's work going,
syv?
12:14:47 syv: Literally nothing has happened.
12:15:18 syv: Bit of fog earlier, but it went away quickly. Otherwise, I haven't seen
a single cloud all night.
12:18:37 Devastator: So.. what are auto Mina and Asha going to do?
12:20:33 ER: start uh, flaying tooru. That seems right
12:21:18 ER: honestly though, it would be reasonable to auto Asha as contenuing to freak out and do nothing
12:21:39 Devastator: Yeah.. but will that kill another character?
12:22:23 syv: At worst, Asha will merely defend Tooru. I don't see her sitting idly by as Tooru is attacked.
12:22:44 syv: She'd certainly be reluctant to charge into battle, away from Tooru, though.
12:22:48 Devastator: Nah, she did strike at the familiars already.
12:23:44 ER: of course, merely defending will not really make tooru's situation any better
12:24:24 ER: unless someone figures out something relevant to do, that'll just get worse
12:24:47 Devastator: I've had suggestions..
12:25:03 Devastator: don't know if they're good ones.
12:25:51 ER: you're both dead and some distance away, so double not present!
12:26:38 Devastator: Well, neither are you, Sophia.
12:26:38 ER: until observed, the Alida exists in
a superposition of shot in the head and not shot in the head.
12:26:50 Devastator: Hey, my soul gem is, like, right there.
12:27:01 syv: And when observed, she remains in said superposition.
12:27:01 ER: Yes, which means that I'm not one the the people who can present
a solution!
12:27:26 Devastator: Can I recover my wet stuff by switching backpacks again?
12:27:53 Devastator: We do have more important stuff, but that's
a fun usage of the ability.
12:29:02 ER: here's
a somewhat mechanical question,
syv
12:29:32 ER: if my soul gem is somewhere that I can't see, does that make me unable to tell what light level it's at?
12:30:35 syv:
Dev, anything that was in Alida's original backpack is still in there, and I guess there's clones of all of it in her current backpack too.
12:30:46 ER: sticking my soul in
a lockbox could have other problems associated with it, but I figure those I'd just have to try it out and see. :P
12:31:03 Devastator: You've got latency issues.
12:31:10 Devastator: but if you're carrying around the lockbox, that'd be fine.
12:31:16 syv: If you try and abuse the laws of physics or causality or something with this, it will go poorly. Don't think about it too hard, 'cause God certainly didn't.
12:31:51 ER: Well, the signal could travel more slowly through the dense material than air, causing delay.
12:32:03 Devastator: I might try something bizarre with that, but in general I need to spend moderate to make
a copy, and cheap-per-turn to keep it going, and I can only keep one copy of everything after dropping the power.
12:32:14 Devastator: It won't involve time travel or anything else weird.
12:32:25 syv: @
ER hard to say. Mechanically I assume people to check their soul level by looking at it (and you can totally forget to check, same as your character), but in-universe there should be some level of sense beyond visual. If your soul gem is very dark, you'll feel bad, and if it's radiant, you'll feel good.
12:32:26 Devastator: But.. what if I were to copy someone else's body that way?
12:32:38 Devastator: Assuming it'd count as an effigy.
12:32:59 Devastator: I thought we simply didn't notice any effects from
a low soul gem until its gone.
12:33:07 syv: In practice, the answer is that I'd likely leave the sheet as it is, unless I were looking to penalize that player, so you can tell your soul level without vision.
12:33:40 Devastator: It shouldn't be
a big deal, anyway. I can't see any advantage to not knowing your soul gem's brightness.
12:33:48 ER: is attempting to make my soul bulletproof something you'd penalize? :V
12:34:02 syv: No cloning other bodies with effigy, unless it's
a small body. I'm just gonna say Effigy works with similar size rules to Stasis.
12:34:38 Devastator: okay, so only stuff that's fairly small.
12:34:47 Devastator: and 'small' on an absolute scale, not relative.
12:34:59 ER: yeah, that's definately something I should at least try.
12:35:03 syv: You? No, because you're pretty liable to kill yourself.
Dev? Maybe, but
Dev kinda shoots himself in the foot as
a masturbatory aide..
12:35:04 Devastator: It must be no bigger than
a backpack, say.
12:35:13 ER: ...with backup, in case it goes wrong.
12:35:23 syv: Lenglon? Or myself? True power gamers? Absolutely.
12:36:01 Devastator: As far as you know, that's only
a hypothetical situation,
syv.
12:36:26 ER: it's somewhat possible that putting my soul in
a safe and closing the door just causes me to lose control of my body, so having someone around to help me would be bineficial.
12:37:24 syv: The thing is, while having your soul in a safe *would* be pretty helpful, it's by no means broken. There's too much powerful stuff which regards a safe as merely
a delay, or outright irrelevant.
12:38:15 syv: Recall Sharon having a massive portion of her torso, armor and all, get blown off by
a single attack.
12:38:43 syv: Isabella's witch form would scarecly have given
a fuck, as well.
12:38:45 ER: ...yes, but it's helpful if I happen to be, say, shot at.
12:39:24 ER: If Isabella thought to armor her soul before fighting enemies with guns, she might have survived that.
12:41:47 Devastator: I wouldn't do it anytime soon, anyway,
syv.
12:42:02 Devastator: 'Getting gun' seems like it would take priority.
12:42:17 syv has quit [Quit: Definitely a psyv.]
12:43:58 Devastator: I think Kali sometimes simply won't take you back.
12:44:22 Devastator: got a present, then blew up an altar, and then sacrificed
a damsel and four live yetis at an altar in the next level.
12:55:27 ER has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
13:05:27 Devastator: "I'm assuming even Starfleet Security can manage not to lose someone while standing next to them in an elevator."
Log file '2018-12-23.log' ends.
93795 bytes processed.