00:28:03 Devastator: GDP per capita, #1 by 25%.
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02:34:11 Devastator: Also, fuck, might want to console-check that.
02:35:10 Devastator: tag-switching to Canada lowers me by one rank. Completing confederation raises Canada one rank of independance from GB. Actually switching the tag via the journal entry resets it to -2.
02:36:31 Devastator: It's pretty noticeable, because rank one is 'pay up 10% of your money' and rank two is '20% of your raw income' For the world's ninth-largest economy, that's.. significant.
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03:46:29 Topic for #einsteinianroulette: MJ should read Extinction!
03:46:29 Topic set by syv [Thursday 29 June 2023, 06:20:36]
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06:09:28 Devastator: that sounds like your kind of game,
syv.
06:22:23 Devastator: you wanted randomly gnerated shooter.
06:22:29 Devastator: Ultrakill would be what I would name such a game.
06:27:12 syv: I wanted randomly generated *tactical* shooter
06:27:19 syv: There's lots of procgen shooters in general
06:27:33 syv: DRG, BPM, a bunch of roguelites
06:27:58 syv: But they're pretty much universally either horde shooters or actiony strafe shooters
06:28:10 Devastator: hordes don't need much work.
06:28:43 Devastator: Also, it's amusing to me that the game is so devoid of flavour, except for the map team. Know how I mentioned a bunch of towns had their old names?Z
06:29:05 Devastator: The names often changed at the right RL time.
06:30:26 Egan: ultrakill is definitely not procgen
06:30:45 Egan: which is good for it, because it benefits from creative level design and enemy placements
06:31:21 Devastator: The map is also super dynamic, adding settlements and roads and such with development.
06:31:27 Devastator: it's like the only bit of flavour they put in the game.
06:33:04 syv: Tactical shooters I feel can benefit a lot from Procgen
06:33:56 syv: Take SWAT 4 or something. Random enemy positions and counts, but every levels has a path through it, and ultimately enemy randomization doesn't change your path, playing properly. Just whether you pull the trigger.
06:34:39 syv: The genre really has a huge element of thinking about how to manuever in an environment, what cover to use, where to peek, etc.
06:35:06 syv: And static maps are learnable. A lot of the fun for me is figuring the path out, so it loses a lot of appeal once I learn it.
06:36:00 Egan: would be a good place to experiment with a level generator which tries to capture a space that makes sense as a real place and not just as a level design
06:36:27 syv: I tried Six Days in Fallujah yesterday, which IS actually a proper tactical shooter with totally procgen levels.
06:36:43 syv: But it's really focused on being... a "documentary game"???
06:37:18 syv: They made it hard as balls with barely any configuration and balanced it for teams of four which play like actual marines.
06:37:49 syv: And kinda stripped away the concept of "clearing" areas in favor of making it so enemies constantly ambush you from everywhere
06:42:26 Devastator: that does sound interesting.
06:42:39 Devastator: how about I promist to poke anyone I think might want to play with the idea?
06:44:01 syv: I didn't mean to get people to play it with me
06:50:17 Egan: the boss I beat was just two enemies who become normal later on. but I guess they pull a bit of a trick on you by making the first few levels way more cramped than most of the game, so you have trouble dodging the basic dudes
06:51:36 Devastator: Nah, someone might want to make it.
06:58:58 syv: SDiF has matchmaking, so if I really wanted to play with a group I could.
06:59:33 syv: I was gonna try it with Saki, because she's oddly interested in shooters, but functionally it's still disappointing for me because I'd like something I can play and enjoy solo.
07:05:04 Devastator: oh, are the orders in kitten clear?
07:11:37 Devastator: right. Now lets hope +2 movment helps me not get chainsawed.
07:12:00 Devastator: Just want a gun because 1 damage/hit isn't going to win very fast. ;-p
07:19:10 syv: Jimothy is kinda intended to make you go "oh AP is useful I should pick some of these guns up"
07:20:50 Devastator: I don't think Alida gets equipmen swaps like she did as a MG, though.
07:21:14 Devastator: Trence has it great, really. Doesn't even notice.
07:22:29 syv: I don't know what you're referring to
07:24:57 Devastator: Trence keeps wearing/having equipped his stuff when a dragon.
07:25:08 Devastator: even though it literally isn't there.
07:27:17 Devastator: Alida, as a PS magical girl, could do costume changes and get all her school/home stuff back at the end of it without worry.
07:43:20 Devastator: I somehow don't think you'll allow a wolf to hoover up guns with her paws or something.
08:25:19 syv: You have to be human to equip/use weapons and armor, excepting certain advancements
08:29:04 Devastator: no magic rings or something?
08:29:08 Devastator: fair 'nuff, though.
08:34:13 syv: Eh, sure, if you find a magic ring you can put it on a toebean
08:41:19 Devastator: ahh. also wondering what advancements are.
08:50:33 Devastator: some of those can get you gear? Interesting.
08:50:58 syv: But more properly, some of them *mess* with gear
08:51:08 Devastator: Oh, that's interesting.
08:51:16 Devastator: so something that messes with gear, when she doesn't have any gear..
08:51:23 Devastator: can you give me a hypothetical?
09:09:12 Egan: thing about a fast nimble boss with basically the same abilities as me
09:09:25 Egan: it feels like he's kicking my ass until I suddenly beat him
09:24:31 syv: Well if you don't have any gear, something that messes with gesr does nothing
09:36:56 Devastator: so some advancement options do nothing.
09:37:20 Devastator: I might not want to be the one experimenting then.
09:39:24 Egan: don't go to BASS if you don't want to trade
09:43:50 Devastator: Right, that was the name of..
09:44:04 Egan: Buy And Sell Shit, the shopcat
09:45:57 Devastator: Huh. Might want to do that.
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10:01:14 Egan: or are you up for the morning? :p
10:01:22 MJ: Nah just haven’t slept yet.
10:01:42 MJ: I wish I had woken up the early it’d be better for my sleep schedule.
10:02:19 MJ: Just got done with a very long chat and needed to decompress for a second.
10:05:16 MJ: Yeah, it’s uhh rather late.
10:05:57 MJ: Expect for you
syv. Don’t sleep up until your shift ends.
10:07:36 Devastator: Not too bad. Hitting the sack soon myself.
10:08:45 MJ: Once my cortisol levels fall a little bit I’ll be doing that.
10:09:38 Devastator: mmm, glorious doctor-speak.
10:09:59 MJ: My tiredness overrides my filter on it
10:11:40 MJ: Cortisol is the stress horomone…..ish. It does a lot of things, but it’s traditional thing and the first thing we found it did was that it was related to like being stressed so that’s why it’s referred to as that
10:12:00 Devastator: ahh, glorious evolution where everything does everything.
10:13:27 MJ: I actually got to argue with an intelligent design proponent at a bar a while ago. It was great fun. Just 30 mintues of complaining about the stupid things the human body does
10:16:42 MJ: The classic one is how bad humans are at giving birth. But my favorite one is that there are two bones in your body that if you break the head of the bone it frequently won’t heal right because there’s only one tiny artery providing blood for that section of bone, and it’s related to like some fucking early vertebrate semi aquatic anatomy.
10:17:24 MJ: I also got to talk about how like there’s a nerve in your neck that goes down your neck and back up because of fucking fish anatomy
10:18:32 Egan: humans are just surprisingly advanced fish
10:19:08 MJ: Yes, and we should have staid as fucking fish as far as I’m concerned. Bipedalism was a mistake
10:19:40 Egan: I think it's pretty handy
10:20:36 MJ: Our spines are like barely able to handle it which is why low back pain is such a problem because the damn vertebral disks don’t regenerate very well and of course when they do go out they just compensate with more bone instead of oh I don’t know more cartilage or something useful.
10:21:32 MJ: Every goddamn vertebrate does this if I recall correctly
10:22:08 Egan: then clearly it works fine!
10:26:27 MJ: It’s also why emergency heart surgery can result in a raspy voice
10:30:15 MJ: Anyway. I feel much better after ranting about the unfortunate decision for fish to leave the water. So I am headed to bed. Goodnight gentlmen and I hope you enjoy the angry old man yelling at clouds approach to teaching evolution.
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12:54:35 syv: Played a bit more of Six Days in Fallujah, this time with Saki. And god, I'm irritated about it. It's basically propaganda.
12:56:37 syv: It's a really hard game. With no ability to make it easier, or tone down difficulty. That's not a hard thing to do--apparently a modder had done it, in very nice increments--the devs refuse to add any easier difficulties to learn the game. Because... Fallujah was a bloody, painful, difficult battle.
12:59:49 syv: But it was nowhere near this game. Coalition forces substantially outnumbered Islamic forces, and had substantially more support. Substantially better armor and weapons.
13:01:45 syv: In this game, you're outnumbered about 8-to-1, worse if you play with less than 4 people (the max, ofc), the enemy can call in mortars on you, they get more variety in gear, their weapons are more lethal (consistently, unarmored enemies take at least three chest shots to kill, versus the armored player's two).
13:03:07 syv: It's deeply unrealistic to what actually was the norm. Shit this bad surely happened to some unfortunate marines, but the game isn't representing it as extreme incidents.
13:04:32 syv: This is somewhat fine, really; it's a game and games should provide some challenge. But it's not a realistic depiction, and the developers use the "realism" aspect of it to justify not making simple features which would make the game better.
13:04:52 syv: When stuff like reducing enemy count would be quite realistic.
13:05:14 syv: It's intended to serve a narrative first, and be a good game second.
13:05:49 syv: Which irks me a good bit, since it's actually creative in one place I WANT to see creativity, procgen maps.
13:06:28 syv: It also irks me that the narrative is essentially a straight up lie, and they're making it be a worse game to *support* that lie
13:06:50 syv: I'm not anti-military at all, but come *on*
13:07:21 syv: Marines were not scared lambs heavily outnumbered by a better armed and more resilient force
13:08:01 syv: They were fighting asymmetric warfare which is fucking harsh, and this game doesn't really depict that at ALL
13:08:24 syv: It's perfectly fine to shoot everything that moves, you never accidentally a civilian, because there are none
13:08:54 syv: Despite this supposedly being a city with 30-90k civilians still inside
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22:18:23 Topic for #einsteinianroulette: MJ should read Extinction!
22:18:23 Topic set by syv [Thursday 29 June 2023, 06:20:36]
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