02:40:03syv: Was gonna send a PM in the Ada&Sophia thread, but I think everyone relevant reads these logs, and I don't really want to add unnecessary informational PM to the thread. My official verdict is that alcohol does not affect an MG's mental functioning at all.
02:41:12syv: However, it *can* affect physical coordination, as the brain is still a required body part for translation, and I'm pretty sure the negative effects on balance and coordination aren't purely mental... if that's even a distinction that can be made. Being shot in the head still disables your body and mundane senses, even if it doesn't affect your thinking ability, so poisoning your brain ought to do the same damage.
02:43:41syv: As for how IS relates to this... I don't like defining this, but I'm tentatively going to say that IS does indeed protect from this, despite the power description only stating that it protects from *environments* and *magical effects*. Poison isn't an environmental effect or a magical effect, but then a literal reading would imply you're immune to magical poison like [tasty] and not nonmagical poison like LSD.
02:44:13syv: I don't want to make that distinction, so bam, IS protects against magical and nonmagical effects, and Sophia is immune to getting drunk.
02:45:34syv: That being said, I think it's fair that she can have a psychological addiction to alcohol, and find the taste somewhat comforting as a placebo, despite not being hit with the actual effects of drunkenness. She doesn't have a physiological dependence, though, no more than any MG has a physiological need for food and water.
02:45:56syv: ...I probably should make this a PM, but I don't want to. :\
02:59:08Devastator: Can they get drunk, only having IS 1, if they take a normally-lethal quantity of alcohol?
02:59:21syv: Eh. Been sleeping... a lot. Work and life messing with my schedule. Had to work yesterday, then slept much of the night, then stuff today, and ehhh...
02:59:52syv: Feel fairly rested now, but I'm answering a PM from ER about a gun system (!) before updating PS.
03:00:02syv: I don't think alcohol counts as a lethal environment.
03:00:34Devastator: because I'd totally count lethal alcohol blood concentrations as a lethal environment.
03:00:54syv: I'mma gonna rule that being submersed in a swimming pool of alcohol is "lethal" because it would drown you, not because it would poison you, so alcohol immunity is moved to IS2.
03:03:12syv: Actually wait, underwater counts as a lethal environ, which is L2. Hah! I don't need to actually make that decision, nevermind!
03:05:33syv: ...And you asked whether IS1 just gives you partial immunity to it, not complete immunity. Erm. Well, no, because technically IS2 is partial immunity. Mechanically the ability was originally intended to give you bonuses to all "resist thing" Purity rolls, which you get against magical effects, but not against alcohol. So giving any benefit against alcohol is sort've an odd use, which kinda makes sense and also doesn't.
03:06:31syv: I suppose since I've basically given full mundane immunity to IS2, it'd make sense to add partial immunity to IS1, but I don't want to think about this, so I'm gonna go with 1 not mattering at all. It is simpler.
03:25:35syv: I tried the mobile surviv app yesterday, it sucked.
03:26:04syv: I also tried PUBG mobile, which ran substantially better, and also remained a substantially worse game.
03:26:56syv: Notably, PUBG mobile also matches you against exclusively bots for the first few rounds. Extremely incompetent bots that seem to have a damage multiplier of ~0.1 or so, in addition to hilariously bad accuracy.
03:28:49syv: I actually had one shoot at me for ~3 minutes, from like twenty feet, while I was prone, it failed to kill me. I was rather confused by how someone could possibly be that bad, which prompted me googling it.
03:31:33syv: I had to play three full 100-"person" matches to unlock alternate game modes, and then I tried 30-person matches, which seemed to be exclusively real people. I don't know how many 100-bot rounds you have to play before you match against other humans, from reading about it it sounds like they slowly wean you off bots, but just don't use bots at all in 30-man games.
03:33:46syv: Seems to be the case. It does sound like they try to fill matches with humans once you've had enough games, but there simply aren't enough mobile players to fill 100-man matches, so they just make up the difference with bots. I looked at some reddit stuff, people seemed to think it was ~20% bots at the higher levels, so I figure it's around 50%.
03:33:56syv: Also I'm not gonna play Surviv right now, for a few reasons. One, I have stuff to do, like finish this PM, and then update PS, and two, I'm at home and therefore have sad sad internet.
03:34:28Devastator: "I felt awesome having a 4:1 kill ratio and almost winning a couple of games."
03:34:44Devastator: I wonder what mine is against exlusively not-bots except player-run ones?
03:35:57syv: I'd estimate at least 5:1, watching you play. And that's accounting for early deaths in the weapons scramble, which is inherently luck based.
03:36:10syv: Also, Surviv player bots are at least insanely good in certain circumstances.
03:36:33syv: PUBG bots literally run up to you, empty their mag from ten feet, then stand still and reload as you turn around.
04:02:25Devastator: and how the fuck was that last guy not dead.
04:02:28syv: I do find it amusing that you're maintaining a 7:1 kill ratio, which is just a bit below my first gut instinct, and an early death now will only drive it down to 6:1.
05:54:16ER: since you mentioned armor penetration, I figure that's okay to lump in with damage?
05:54:55ER: my doc DOES contain the words "ballistic armor" with zero context :V
05:55:19syv: I consider it heresy to not include some kind of AP stat which only functions to reduce how much armor mitigates direct damage, while not helping at all against unarmored targets.
05:55:33syv: I can reluctantly admit that maybe that's not necessary, though.
05:56:00ER: I mean lump it in as one of the damage types in the damage entry :V
05:56:32ER: health 2 AP 3 means it does 2 damage to health and ignores 3 ballistic armor
06:03:20ER: note that my making a gun system partly stems from suddenly wanting to do the cyberpunk game but with totally unnecesary fantastical elements that are initially hidden.
06:04:09ER: after all, why *wouldn't* I want a secret cabal of wholly magical vampires in an otherwise technological setting and not make it clear that's what you're getting into?
06:17:51syv: Would the +3 cap apply in FMD? Seems a bit low.
06:18:40ER: also I agree that in some ways you're the wrong person to ask about this stuff, but I do want to offload gun stats to you, which involves showing you to system. :V
06:19:24ER: I'd think the +3 cap would apply even with magic, yeah.
06:20:52syv: But yeah, you definitely need to have resolve damage independant from vitality damage then, 'cause a bunch of guns in my armory are integrally suppressed.
06:20:58ER: I know enough to know there's like, lots of different rifles with different roles, but not enough to stat them myself.
06:22:15ER: damage would be something like 4 Health, 1 AP, 3 Resolve, is that seperated enough?
06:22:25ER: probably didn't explaint that well enough
06:23:24ER: you take damage to resolve. Once you reach 0, you need to roll Bravery or pretty much just lose.
06:24:43ER: Unless there's no hope of survival if you give up, in which case you succeed automatically but lose a chunk of stamina. Survial instincts.
06:24:57syv: Mm. I'd make it so that you roll bravery to resist taking any damage, and if you fail you take one point of morale damage, plus you're forced to take cover or something. Or maybe you're either forced to take cover *or* take damage. Unless firearms just deal basically no resolve damage, it's way too harsh as-is.
06:25:14ER: You'll fight harder if you're trapped in a room with a horror movie villain. :V
06:25:42syv: If one guy with an LMG shooting at you basically just forces you to lose immediately, regardless of his own skill, then that's bad.
06:27:05ER: solution: don't get into LMG fights. :V
06:27:59syv: Also, uh, there should be some way to differentiate different weapon types. Maybe if you don't want to get into that stuff I was talking about, with resolve damage by bullet, just give each gun a resolve difficulty that is only rolled against if you use autofire, and targets either have to cower in cover or take 1 resolve damage if they fail the check.
06:29:16syv: If there's no such number, then being shot at by an SMG or LMG is basically equivalently fuck-you. Since you only have 3 resolve, even a basic SMG can at worst only be 1/3 as scary as the best LMG.
06:29:45ER: It's probably inevitable that I'll give PCs some big advantage in the resolve game because they're PCs and people like having control of their characteer.
06:29:47syv: ...And then that implies the best LMG being an instawin regardless of skill, or three people with SMGs being an instawin...
06:30:13ER: Oh, stat numbers will probably be higher than TH.
06:30:26syv: Well then you should probably build the system with that in mind, considering you talked about PvP, and PvP means players will be shooting at players.
06:30:57syv: "(ER) damage would be something like 4 Health, 1 AP, 3 Resolve, is that seperated enough?"
06:31:19syv: See, I'm an idiot and read that as "Players would have something like 4 vitality, 1 armor, 3 resolve"
06:44:28syv: Well, you've got my input. If you want to take it, take it, if you don't, don't. I think it'd be completely idiotic to discard it for reasons of "makes sense to me", since everything I said has specific calculated reasons behind it, but I can't force you to do things my way.
06:45:06syv: Though if you make it too absurd then I won't stat guns for you. Need enough design space, and all. Maybe I'll give you.
06:46:21ER: Definately have different targets for four ot three range increments. That's enough to differenciate pistols and snipers to me.
06:49:42ER: run and gun is a seperate roll from hitting, because I'm cruel like that
06:49:52syv: Let me restate. I have a gun with difficulty 10 short range, difficulty 11 medium range, and difficulty 12 moving--ahh, yes, there.
06:50:45ER: see, another thing different between gun types. Pistols might be quite easy to runa nd gun with, while long rifles less so.
06:50:46syv: So having multiple 3d6 rolls per each individual shot, which a single player will be making multiple of in one round, is simpler than having an additional two skills which will only change once per mission cycle at most?
06:51:34ER: you only roll run and gun once per turn, and you only shoot multiple times per turn with semiauto
06:55:47syv: I've actually shifted to making continual progress, without scrapping it. The biggest reason I'm not done already is that I keep saying "well, I should work on the game I'm actually running, instead. People enjoy that game already."
07:00:15syv: Then go do that instead. More people find it pleasurable than just you, while you're the only person who enjoys making yet another game you won't actually run.
07:04:48ER: like I said, I thought it would be funny to do a cyberpunk city with vampires in it, and this was prerequisite.
07:10:08Devastator: Aren't there vamps in shadowrun?
07:24:31ER: uh, does bug hover low enough to be in range 8? ...sure.
07:26:44syv: TBF, most games that does work, and did work. Read the first post, make a char, drop in. I don't think PS even has more words than PW's systems, and she got in at least two of them.
07:29:52Devastator: Would have been ok in Barbarians!
07:30:07Devastator: I don't thnink I would have said no to another barbarian just showing up, although probably between missions or something.
08:59:23syv: Not as many tubes jokes as I recall. Far more completely idiotic "jokes". Apparently all the tubes jokes were judged to be quality when he decided to upload the best to imgur.
09:01:18ER: "Hildegard was wrong too, not that you ever truly thought otherwise. This is the path to victory. You'll prove Hannah wrong, you can win--you will win, and you'll take as many girls along with you as you can."
09:19:39ER: would you give different gun different EXP costs to gain familiarity with them? :P
09:20:54ER: Thinking for reloads it should be "reloading takes a full turn, unless you're familiar with the specific weapon, which lets you roll to reload instantly"
09:21:54ER: means the more complex bit only comes up if you've got the feat. and what are feats for but introducing complexity?~
09:22:28syv: Uhh. Probably not, but it's not all that unreasonable. Though... exp cost to gain familiarity with just about any firearm should be cheap, as long as it isn't including disassembly. Basic operation of most guns is very simple. Complete strip cleaning... that can get insane.
09:23:36syv: AK-47? "Sure, I can teach you in a half hour. Less if you're a quick learner!"